Student Success

Andy Rodford — Principal of Venture Gained Consulting

Andy Rodford is a seasoned educator and consultant with over 30 years of experience in both traditional and outdoor education. As Principal of Venture Gained Consulting, he currently works with K-12 schools, universities, camps, businesses, and leaders across North America, helping them bring strategic plans to life, build stronger teams, and create the time and space to focus on what really matters.

Andy’s background is a blend of academics and experienced leadership. He holds degrees in Biology, Geography, and Education, along with a Master’s in Educational Leadership and Management. He’s been a Head of School and Deputy Head at independent day and boarding schools, led Admissions and Advancement teams, and directed a large outdoor education center and summer camp, bringing his passion for experiential learning to life.

Beyond his institutional roles, Andy is a sought-after speaker and workshop leader at educational and camping conferences, sharing insights on leadership, change and risk management, strategic planning, and program development. When he’s not working with schools and organizations, you’ll likely find him wood carving, boating, or exploring the outdoors.

Connect with Andy Rodford: Email | Linkedin

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Resources Mentioned

Venture Gained Consulting

The Transcript

**Please note that all of our transcriptions come from rev.com and are 80% accurate. We’re grateful for the robots that make this possible and realize that it’s not a perfect process.

Sam Demma
Welcome back to another episode on the High Performing Educator Podcast. This is your host, Sam Demma. And today we are joined by Andy Rodford. Andy brings over 30 years of diverse educational expertise to his role as principal of Venture Gained Consulting, where he partners with schools, universities, camps, and businesses across North America to implement strategic plans and building effective teams. His multifaceted background combines academic credentials in biology, geography, education, and a master’s in educational leadership with hands-on experience as a head of school, deputy head, admissions and advancement leader, and outdoor education center director. As a respected speaker and workshop facilitator at educational conferences, Andy shares his insights on leadership and program development while maintaining his personal connection to the outdoors through wood carving, boating and exploration. Andy, thank you so much for taking the time to come on the show here today.

Andy Rodford
Well, it’s great to be here, Sam. Thanks for having me on the show.

Sam Demma
How long have you been carving wood, my friend?

Andy Rodford
Well, you know what? I’ve been carving for now almost 25 years. And I had a friend that taught with the First Nations group in Hidaway, and he was our teacher at the local school. And he taught me the basics like he was taught from First Nations. And so I’ve been carving for 25 years. It is like zen. It’s my happy place. I’m not very good with idle time. So the reality of doing some wood carving, I mean, I can get lost in wood carving for hours and hours and hours and hours and just forget what day it is.

Sam Demma
It’s great. I noticed when we started the Zoom call for people tuning in, I saw something in Andy’s background. It looked like a wooden head of a bear behind you. Is that something that you carved?

Andy Rodford
No, it’s actually just a stuffed bear that somebody gave me years ago that I just thought, like every gentleman’s office ought to have like some sort of bear head, right? That’s awesome. No, not really. But actually, you know what, in the same background, you can actually see there’s wood carving that’s hanging on the wall. And it’s called a chain saw. So it’s the handle of a saw carved, like everybody knows what a handle of a saw looks like. And then it’s a series of wood loops that are all interconnected, but that are all carved from one piece of wood.

Sam Demma
Wow.

Andy Rodford
Yeah, so it’s pretty cool. And it turns into a chain where all the links are all separated. Yeah, it’s kind of fun.

Sam Demma
The audience wasn’t expecting this conversation, but last question on woodworking. What was the longest amount of time you spent working on one piece? And what was it?

Andy Rodford
You know what, I carved an orca as my first 3D, you know, sort of wood carving project with the help of the same guy that taught me. And I think I spent, I carved it out of Arbutus, which is a local wood on the West Coast that is very First Nations connected and it’s a beautiful wood, but it’s hard and it’s a tricky kind of thing to carve. And the orca is probably about two feet long and it’s in an arch like it’s coming out of the water. And I spent hundreds of hours on it. But you know, Sam, the carving was one thing, but then it’s the sanding. And I can see why First Nations carvers have apprentices that do a lot of sanding, because it’s a huge amount of work, but super proud of it because it was my first go at it. And so it’s one of the pieces that sort of sits around my house here that people comment when they come. But just the last point about that, the sanding of Arbutus, the last grit that you use is like 1500, which is like jewelry paper. Wow. And when it’s finished, it feels like marble. Like that’s how smooth and dense the grain is.

Andy Rodford
And so it’s a really fun thing to carve with, but it is kind of tricky because it’s really hard. Hard wood.

Sam Demma
That’s exceptional. Thank you for sharing that. It sounds like you have been working on wood carvings almost as long as you’ve worked in education. You know, tell me a little bit about your 30 years of experience in education and how you got into it.

Andy Rodford
Yeah, well, thanks for asking. I always wanted to be a teacher. I went to, to, I grew up in Quebec and in Ontario and I went to summer camp, which lots of kids do in the East. I went to camp for 25 years in a row. I started at six and then just sort of stuck with it the whole way. So, you know, I became hardwired to be an experiential teacher, you know, in the world of, you know, being a counsellor and a program director and a canoe tripper and all those right up to being a director of a large outdoor ed center in Ontario, which had, you know, like 900 kids and 140 staff and 17 countries worth of kids. It was like, it was like the, my first kick at the can of being a head of school. And so I really wanted, I really wanted to be a teacher. That’s one of the reasons why I have degrees in biology and geography, because when I went to university, I wanted to be able to have degrees in two different departments so that I could actually be very hireable and teach in the social sciences, geography, or in the science side of things. But when I started in teaching, I started in a very traditional classroom with a department head that probably should have retired like 10 years before I started teaching, and who was like the opposite of experiential educator. And then I really should have started my teaching career in the last 10 years because what I was doing like almost 30 years ago was very kind of camp focused. My classrooms were fun. We did a lot of fun things. We did a lot of experiential work, but back then it was objective-based learning. So it was like, you were supposed to go from 1.3 to 1.5 to 1.7 and assign things to be memorized for homework and all that kind of stuff. So I ditched classroom teaching early, went back to running outdoor education full-time for years as the director of a big camp. And then I had to make a decision, Sam, as to whether I was gonna be that guy that was gonna be like an 80 year old camp director, still doing like summer camp, or whether I was gonna actually come back into the school world.

Andy Rodford
So I put the word out, the independent schools and the private summer camps kind of run parallel to each other. And so when I put the word out that I was gonna come back into education, I actually came back into education as a senior director of a school. So I came right back in as a director of admissions and advancement and so I really in my career kind of bypassed that whole slog of working my way up through the teaching ranks. But it meant that at a really young age I became a really, you know, I became a senior staff member. I became a head of school, for example, when I was 38, which generally is about a decade earlier than most people who get their first headship. So I jump-started that. And then ultimately, when I was getting towards the end of my career, I realized that I didn’t really want to be head of school, mostly because of dealing with governance and all the politics. I love the interactions with the kids. I love the learning, the staff work, the building capacity, like a lot of the things that I’m doing now in my consulting practice, I was able to do by not being a head of school. So that’s why I was a deputy head of school for you know 12 years and when they when they actually went my last school they changed the head you know they did a search and uh and I didn’t apply uh even though I’d been at the school for five or six years at that point too much to people’s like you know like oh you got to be kidding me like you’re and I didn’t apply for all the same reasons that I just told you. And then the head couldn’t come for a year because of his contract. So the board came to me and said, we know you know how to do this job. So then I became head of school for like 14 months until the new head came. And then I went back to my deputy head role up to the point where I stopped like a year and a half ago.

Sam Demma
Okay, this is fascinating to me because I think a lot of people think there’s such linear paths toward certain positions in education, but also in any career or any industry in life. You’ve taken a very different approach.

Sam Demma
When you reflect on your experience as the Ed Director for camps, what are the skills you feel that you learned that were very applicable to that immediate position in a senior role with a school?

Andy Rodford
Well, I can tell you, and I know it’s kind of a theme of the podcast. I mean, it is all about the people. I said it when I ran the camp, I said it over and over many times at all the schools that I worked at. The schools, for example, or the camp will be here for hundreds of years after we’re all dead. And so while we’re here, we have to look after each other and we have to get the most out of our relationships. And because that’s where the capacity and that’s where the horsepower comes from, is harnessing all of that. And, and so I learned right away, you know, about the management of trust, for example, right. And that, you know, the the management of trust is, is, you know, it’s the thread that holds the whole organization together, but, but it’s work, and it has to be created and, and, and it has to be earned, and, and it has to be intentional, right? So I learned, you know, early, I actually had for another time, maybe a story where I had my entire leadership style changed in one conversation in in 1995.

Andy Rodford
With a with a mentor interaction that I had that that that just changed my whole leadership style to to be, you know, to recognize the fact that, you know, saying no to somebody is not a career ender. Being friends with everybody and kind of like going the extra mile in order to make sure that nobody dislikes you or any of those sorts of things are things that people like learn over time. Well, I had the advantage of having that information delivered to me in 1995 in one conversation by a mentor who knows who he is, and he changed my entire leadership style that I carry with me today.

Sam Demma
What did that individual say to you or make you feel that shifted that perspective so deeply for you?

Andy Rodford
Yeah, you know what? He was giving me the results of a 360 sort of feedback evaluation that I had asked for. And at that stage in my career, I was in the yeah, but stage. So, right. And I think we all kind of recognize that, you know, like you get a bit of feedback and then you go, yeah, but you know, and then you kind of just explain it away. And anyway, this, this guy was patient to a point and, and, and then he just kind of lost it on me. Like he, he just, he got mad at me in a way that almost like my own parents have never got mad at me. Like we kind of went up one side and down the other. And, and, you know, it was all about the management of a management of trust. It was all about, you know, the consistency and, and, and maybe if I can give you an example of that kind of demonstrates it, right. So if a camp, for example, if I had a counselor, so I’m the director of the camp, I’m carrying the clipboard, you know, I got all the really important camp director things that I gotta do, camp directors. And a counselor comes to me and says, Andy, the light bulb in my cabin is out and I need a new light bulb. And I dutifully write it down on my clipboard that Sam needs a new light bulb and then we part ways and all that sort of stuff. And then because I’m super busy in my role, I’m now on page four of my to-do list, right? So your light bulb is still mixed in there. But meanwhile, Sam is sitting in the dark. It’s now day three. You hate me because you asked for it. I’ve seen you like a hundred times and you’ve never said anything more about the light bulb to me. Now, as a director, every time you and I are walking by each other, I’m like, why is Sam giving me like the hairy eyeball light about, you know, like, cause I don’t even know what I’ve not done. And, and so if you back that up and go to a place where you say, Sam comes to me and says, I need a light bulb for my cabin. I should say at that point, Sam, listen, you know what? I don’t do light bulbs.

Andy Rodford
You need to go directly to the maintenance guys and get a light bulb. And as much as you don’t feel like you’re being service minded to Sam, that redirect might be off-putting for Sam, but A, he gets his light bulb within the next 10 minutes, and most importantly, Sam, you will never ask me for a light bulb ever again in our entire relationship, because you know the answer on where you get light bulbs from, and you don’t go to the director for that, right? So the notion of managing that trust and managing those elements, right? Because the first way I gave you, you know, the trust piece is going like right, you know, down the toilet almost, right? Like it’s in a death spiral if that just kind of carried on with no light bulb in day four, day five, whatever it was, right? And where I was curt with you and, and pushed you to another source, but it’s over. You got your light bulb and everybody’s learned and it didn’t even get onto my list. Right. So it’s, um, you know, a few things like that learning along, along the way, um, you know, was a, was a big, big advantage for me when I was younger in my career.

Sam Demma
You mentioned that you asked for feedback and that conversation was the result of this individual giving you this 360 feedback. How do you think about giving someone on your team feedback when they haven’t asked for it and you kind of wish in the back of your head that they did. Is that ever a situation the leader finds himself in? And how do you manage giving someone some suggestions when maybe they haven’t asked for them?

Andy Rodford
Right, well, that’s a responsibility that you have in the leadership mode, right? And I think that most organizations should have some sort of structure where they have feedback relative to your priorities. And there’s different kinds of feedback models that you can use that are really super friendly, even when it’s tricky information. And so, as a leader, you triage stuff, right? So is this something that I need to tell you right away because it’s a safety concern? Is this something that’s attached to your professionalism? Is this something that is like a nudge? Wouldn’t it be great if you maybe did this and considered it, like that kind of thing. There’s a whole gradation of the reasons why you would give feedback. But I think that most organizations should have some structure where there’s annual feedback or regular feedback. You know, a lot of schools and organizations have drifted into coaching cultures so that it just becomes part of every conversation. And I can talk more about a little bit of that later on in the conversation, because I have really strong opinions around the notion that every interaction that you have with anybody should be viewed as an opportunity, no matter how small.

Sam Demma
You believe that having a people first approach is really important. One of my mentors always says, you build the people and the people build the business, or you build the people and the people build the institution. It sounds like you have a similar philosophy. Tell me a little bit about that idea of the people first approach, and then maybe we can lead that into this idea of the coaching culture.

Andy Rodford
Sure. Well, I think that people first approach, I mean, you know, the, the, um, your friend is right. Like, you know, the reality is, is that you can build the most amazing, um, structure and organization, but if you don’t have the people, um, to, to run it, it’s doomed, right? Just like from a school context, if you have really great people, excellent teachers, excellent staff, you can teach kids in a trailer. In my case, you can teach them in the out of doors, at an outdoor aid, et cetera. You don’t need to fancy anything, right? So, I think it’s about prioritizing the, you know, sort of well-being growth and the engagement of people who make up the school community. So the staff and the students and the families and alumni and, you know, other community members and it’s, and it’s really sort of like the mindset that sees culture as the foundation for successful operations and not as a by-product of the operations.

Sam Demma
Right? So you’re intentional about the culture.

Andy Rodford
Very much so, right? Because if you put the people first approach in action, you know that educators thrive when they feel like trusted and supported and students learn the best when they feel like trusted and supported and students learn the best when they feel safe and understood, right? You know, when they belong. I mean, I mentioned before that I said that every interaction is an opportunity. Well, I made a sticker about a decade ago that actually says, enduring success emerges when learners are understood, engaged, achieving. And then it says, how are you ensuring that every interaction is an opportunity? And I gave that sticker to our 170 teachers in the school. And then of course they all looked at it and said, oh, that totally makes sense. If I understand Sam, then I know how he ticks, then that’s the avenue for him to be engaged. And when you’re engaged, you achieve. And then I said to them, I said, okay, well, that’s fine. But what’s your proof that Sam feels understood by you? And the whole room froze.

Andy Rodford
Like they just went dead silent, right? Because, you know, it’s super different to think about the data that you need to collect when you’re interacting with somebody to know that they feel understood by you. But you and I both, like I mentioned, one of my mentors, right, that changed my leadership style. I mean, everybody listening to your podcast will have somebody, a trusted adult in their world, that they really truly feel understood by them.

Andy Rodford
And then all of a sudden, you’ll walk like 15 kilometers in the snow to stand in their garbage, right? Like uphill both ways. You know, you’re totally engaged and then when that happens, then the achievement comes. You know, I’ll make a couple more points if that’s okay. If you adopt the mindset that every interaction is that opportunity, then, because you don’t know what’s going on in anybody else’s life, right? And there’s an old teacher adage that you may never, you may never get the chance to sit in the shade of the tree that you plant, right? And that’s because we teach kids and then they go off. And then only when you get old like me that they come out of the woodwork and they’re like, Oh, remember, you know, now they’re like 40 something and they’ve got kids of their own. And I say, Oh, my gosh, I say the same things to my kids as I as you said to me, you know, it’s, it’s pretty funny. But I had I had the number 212 on my bulletin board in my office for years. And people would come in and they’re like, what is that? You know, what is that? And I said, well, it was all about this concept, right? So 212 is the temperature that water boils. Right? And when water’s 211 degrees, it’s just really super hot, but you add one small, single inconsequential degree. To that water and it changes state, you know, it releases like masses of energy, you know, the, and, and so you just don’t know what one tiny thing along the way, good or bad, is going to like send somebody into that altered state. So if you think about that every time you’re having interactions with people from a people-first approach standpoint, then everything that you’re doing is kind of authentic, authentic, even though it has like a strategic kind of feel to it.

Sam Demma
I love that idea. I also, I have, I had an image in my head of the person who I feel understood by outside of my family, pop into my head immediately as you were talking about this whole idea of people that make us feel understood. And I started thinking about what that person did that made me feel understood and asking thoughtful questions, doing more listening than speaking, um, shifting my belief by asking, uh, intelligent questions, leading with humility, almost like a quiet champion. I’m curious, what are the commonalities you’ve found over the years of these people that tend to make other people feel understood? How do they do it?

Sam Demma
There might be a teacher listening that’s curious and they want to make their students or staff feel understood.

Andy Rodford
Yeah, well, I think, you really just have to, um, adopt the notion of, of the fact that you, from a leadership standpoint or from a teacher or whatever, whatever role where there’s a indifference in the power structure or, you know, there’s this implied notion that students are learning from us and blah, blah, blah, all that sort of stuff, even though I’m a firm believer that we learn way more from the kids. They say it takes a village to raise a child, but I think it takes a bunch of children to raise the village. That’s the real notion of it. And if you’re a leader and you’re, well, everybody’s a leader, but I mean, if you’re in a position where you have some control over the culture, if you believe that strong relationships drive better communication, collaboration, and outcomes, then you should be as motivated to find ways to do that in the best possible way.

Andy Rodford
Just like you want to find best ways to manage your budget and prioritize your well-being and all those sorts of things. So it just means that you have to become like super intentional and you need to like model empathy and active listening. You know, we talked about the management of trust, you know, valuing input from everyone, like so creating the structures that give everybody a genuine voice. So not just like, you know, surveys, but kind of real dialogue that gets data from people. And what else?

Andy Rodford
You know, investing in professional growth. I know that you’re so keen on the professional growth aspect as am I, right? So not just compliance training, but you know, all of the skills that we’re talking about are ones that are their skills. Like, so they, they got, they’d have to be learned and they also have to be like practiced over and over and over. Right. And if you lead with transparency, you know, like if you’re open about how decisions come and you actually recognize when you make mistakes, you know, that kind of vulnerability, um, you know, you become a bit of a magnet for, you know, that relationship that you’re talking about, right? You know, here’s another sort of like spin of that kind of thing. We use the word mentor a lot. And, you know, my concept of mentor, which a dear friend of mine shared with me and I couldn’t agree with more, is that mentor is very much a noun, right? So it’s always capitalized, right? And being a mentor is a gift. It’s not, right? It’s not something that you are to somebody else. It is that concept that somebody else has established you as a mentor. So when they call you a mentor, it’s a gift as opposed to a structure.

Sam Demma
I love it. I look forward to reading Chiz’s book.

Andy Rodford
Oh, you know who I’m talking about.

Sam Demma
I had the pleasure of having a conversation with him as well. And he shared so many unique ideas. You share so many philosophies that he shares and I am so grateful that I had the opportunity to chat with him and even now chat with you. I can draw a ton of similarities which are really inspiring. On the notion of professional development, because I know it’s something you value deeply and it sounds like a successful team values it as well. One of my favorite inspirations was a gentleman named Jim Rohn, who’s passed away now, but he wrote lots and has lectures online that I love listening to. And he would always say, your professional success will never exceed your personal development. He was a big advocate for the personal growth aspect of any job or career you get into. When you think of personal development, are there any resources that have been really instrumental in your own life or that you always lean on when it comes to teams? And maybe it’s not specific resources, but activities, exercises, or anything of that nature.

Andy Rodford
Yeah, well, I mean, there’s loads and loads of them, Sam. Like, you know, and you mentioned Ian Chisholm with the Roy group, like just to put that plug right in there, right? I mean, Ian and I have been good friends for a long time and, you know, we golf occasionally and we meet for coffee on a pretty regular basis, all that kind of stuff, right? So we definitely share a lot of mindset, but, you know, like the, interestingly enough, I would give Ian much credit in his, the structure that he puts in places with the Roy group that allows you to build on your leadership capacity, right? And they do a lot of stuff on looking in the opportunities in conflict. So instead of recognizing a conflict might be a hurdle, there’s always an opportunity that that’s connected to that. Right. So there’s a whole element of work and body that they do that would dovetail very much with what you’re asking about. best approaches. I think that finding, it’s really important to stay current in the changing landscape. So, Protea helps you stay informed and allows you to sort of lead from a place of knowledge as opposed to reaction, right? You know, there’s, you can go to conferences that help you sharpen your strategic thinking so that you can think in bigger picture stuff, you know, and how to align people and purpose and priorities, all that kind of stuff. You know, the, the, the, the reality of, of, of just sort of having that mindset of constant improvement in your leadership practice is key because then once you have that lens, so many different things like big programs for sure that are offered, but also little tiny things, right? Like I use a program, a protocol that’s by, from the National Reform Faculty Protocols, which, so which, which I’m a coach of. And, and they, you know, like there’s a, you know, a thing called Chalk Talk, for example, and Harvard University uses it a lot, you know, where, where you put some, you know, four or five really tricky questions around the room on chart paper, and, and you get all your people in there, you split them into groups. So there’s a group at each chart. And, and everybody gets a marker, and there’s no talking. So every every five minutes, like for five minutes, you write all of your answers feverishly, you comment on other people’s comments as they’re as you’re writing with your marker, and you move to the next question, which has already got everybody else’s thinking started. And by the time that you get around to the end, you have the whole room summarized their thoughts, and where you started, that group can actually look at where all the agreements are. I tell you that only because the coolest part is that there’s equity of voice in that, right? So if you’re thinking about the team, there’s lots of people on the team that just won’t put their hand up. They just, you know, they’re like submarines, right? Like they just kind of cruise around under the water. And then every now and then the periscope comes up and they say stuff that can swing an entire room. But, but there’s usually three or four people in the room who, you know, like to hear their own voice and, and, uh, and, you know, kind of monopolize things from time to time. So, you know, there’s leadership strategies along the way that help mitigate all of, all of those sorts of things. So this is what I’m talking like, management of trust is work.

Sam Demma
I know we’re a little over time here. Is it okay if I ask a few more questions? Yeah, 100% yeah, fire away. Tell me about your concept of the coaching culture.

Andy Rodford
Well, you know what, I think the coaching culture is key because you know, you’re constantly, it’s not filled with judgment. It’s built on the notion of growth. You’re open to the idea of feedback. There’s ways of using coaching models in order to build culture, in the sense of everybody having a shared language and a shared mindset. They all think differently, but they know how to communicate. Like I can tell you, if it wasn’t for a coaching culture that we had, our school would have not made it through COVID like we did. Right? The work that we put into in developing our coaching culture and how we communicate with each other, it made it easier for making decisions. And I think, you know, just as well as anybody else, that there were like decisions per hour that needed to be made. And then you get to the end of that day and every protocol changed for the next morning. So, you know what I mean? Like the, you know, people were potentially at their wits end, but because we had done all the work in the coaching culture and because we had invested in professional development and because we had managed trust, through that whole process, people had assumed best intentions. So, the gang who were at the school, who very easily could be like, Oh my gosh, are you kidding me? We have to put like more red tape on the ground. We have to close off all the fountains. We have to do all this sort of stuff and, you know, move our kids around. Anyways, as we came out with each change, they assumed best intentions. They knew, you know, Andy’s not doing this just for fun. Ah. He’s not doing this to mess with us. He’s not doing it, you know, I don’t understand why we’re doing it. I don’t agree with what we’re doing, but I’m going to pause and I’m going to ask clarifying questions. Right?

Andy Rodford
And, and those clarifying questions come without judgment, you know, and they’re answered without judgment. And so it just becomes, you know, a great way for, you know, check-ins can happen and shaping decisions. And it gives you, because you’re dealing with individuals, you know, sort you’re dealing with individuals, sort of feedback back and forth, it gives you way more opportunities to celebrate accomplishments along the way, which is something that helps build that, because it would be the questions that you’re asking as a coach-mentee kind of relationship, goes right at the heart of where their successes are. And to use a Roy group thing, you know, from a feedback standpoint, things are either, you know, either went well, they were tricky, and then what would you do differently if we’re going to do this again in the future, right? Like those become like the only three questions that really are important to ask. I love the idea of assuming best intentions.

Sam Demma
I even think about it in everyday life. Someone shows up late to a meeting, assume something went wrong and hope that they’re okay. Someone cuts you off in traffic, assume they’re rushing their kid to the hospital. It’s just a more joyful way to live your life than to assume the negative, right?

Andy Rodford
Right, but that’s work. Like you have to trap yourself in that moment to not have that instinctual sort of rage or whatever else, just from your traffic standpoint. Anyway, that is the key thing. But again, it comes with the foundation that you’ve built long before anything adverse happens.

Sam Demma
This has been such an insightful conversation. I really appreciate the time you’ve invested to have this conversation. If anyone’s listening and wants to reach out to you or do some work with you with venture gain consulting, what would be the best way for them to get in contact?

Andy Rodford
Well, I have my website is venture gained.ca. And so it’s pretty easy to get there. And and and there’s a contact page and all that kind of stuff. But Sam, the one thing I’ll say is that for those that are listening, I have a blog and a podcast page on the website that’s just filled with help-filled blogs. So things like the management trust pieces on there, the one degree of education, that’s the 212 thing, harnessing the power of productive failure, critical importance of cultivating leadership skills and teachers, embracing the power of differences. You know, there’s all kinds of things in there. And then I just posted one that is about the wet dog syndrome, because there’s the Canadian schools are getting together this week. And so I’ve posted that and the West, the wet dog syndrome of professional development, because people go to professional development and then they come back to their organizations. And and if you’ve ever been, you know, by the water side when a dog comes out of the water, what’s what do they do? They shake, right. And and you and water sprays all over the place. That’s the feeling that people have when others come back from professional development. They kind of just quietly sort of back away from you, you know, because they know they’re just gonna hit, you’re gonna hit them with all their new learning and we gotta change this and we gotta do that. And we, you know, and so it’s like the wet dog syndrome. So anytime I teach a workshop, I talk to the crowd about the wet dog syndrome and being, you know, there’s a whole toolbox in there about how to bring that learning back to your organization and get people to sort of buy in and adjust things. So it’s not just like 5% of what you learned. It can be like 95% of what you learned.

Sam Demma
That’s awesome. I love that metaphor. Would the blog have a special link or is it your website forward slash podcast or blog?

Andy Rodford
It’s actually, um, I think it’s just forward slash blog, but if you go onto the website, um, it’s like the first tab, you’ll, you’ll, you’ll, you’ll see it. And just says, it just says blogs. And then, uh, and then click away. There’s about 25 different helpful bits and pieces in there.

Sam Demma
Awesome. Thank you so much, Andy. I’m taking some notes here. This has been phenomenal. Keep up the amazing work that you’re doing. And I hope to see some of your wood carvings in the future.

Andy Rodford
Yeah, well, there’s actually a blog post that’s gonna be coming out on the 8th that has a whole bunch of my carving on it. And because the whole notion of the blog post is about humanizing us as teachers and leaders, right? What does Sam do in his life that’s really interesting that I don’t know about that would make you way more connective to me in a professional relationship. And so I’ve got a whole blog that’s coming out. And so on the front page of the blog has a whole bunch of examples of my carving.

Sam Demma
That’s awesome. Thank you so much for sharing that. I find that maintaining personal practices while you pursue professional endeavors is so important. And anytime I’ve let go of those things, I start to enjoy my work less. I could, and sometimes I convince myself that I’m too busy to do certain things, but.

Andy Rodford
Yeah, yeah, well, so if you ever interview people that have worked with me, you’ll realize that one of the things that I did when I was at the school was I outlawed the word busy. You weren’t allowed to use the word busy and you weren’t allowed to use the word change. So, busy, when somebody says, oh, I’m so busy, then the instinct is that we need to rescue you. And then if you ask them for, you know, what help do you need? They’re usually like, oh, no, no, I’m good. It’s just that I, you know, and then all of a sudden, it’s like, well, actually, what your week is is full. And your day is hectic. But you’re not like a turtle that’s flipped on its back. It’s busy. And so, and then the change aspect is just, change is paralyzing, right? But if you shift, shift is easy.

Sam Demma
I love it. Thank you for sharing that shift.

Andy Rodford
Well, and there’s piles of shift all over the place. Like you can have some fun words that you can have fun with the word shift. Yeah, don’t throw your shift in my backyard. There’s a whole bunch on there. That’s awesome.

Sam Demma
Thanks so much, Andy. This is lovely. This is lovely.

Andy Rodford
Well, it’s a pleasure and thank you very much for having me on your show.

Join the Educator Network & Connect with Andy Rodford

The High Performing Educator Podcast was brought to life during the outbreak of COVID-19 to provide you with inspirational stories and practical advice from your colleagues in education. By tuning in, you will hear the stories and ideas of the world’s brightest and most ambitious educators. You can expect interviews with Principals, Teachers, Guidance Counsellors, National Student Association, Directors and anybody that works with youth. You can find and listen to all the episodes for free here.

Taylor Uroda – Student Life and Leadership Assistant and Mathu Vijayakumar – Orientation and Transition Assistant at Trent University Durham

About Taylor Uroda and Mathu Vijayakumar

Taylor Uroda (she/her) is completing a Bachelor’s in Social Work at Trent University Durham GTA. In her role as the Student Life and Leadership Assistant with the Student Life Team, Taylor plays a key part in developing student engagement initiatives and leadership programming, helping to foster a welcoming and dynamic campus environment.

A passionate advocate for the helping profession, Taylor has gained valuable hands-on experience working within the social service worker field, where she connects with individuals and communities to support their success. Her dedication to making a positive impact is fuelled by her belief in empowering others and promoting personal growth.

Taylor is particularly interested in pursuing a career in gerontology, where she hopes to enhance the lives of older adults through compassionate care and individualized support. She is driven by a desire to make meaningful contributions to her community and is always seeking opportunities to grow both personally and professionally.

Outside of her academic and professional pursuits, Taylor is a coffee enthusiast and puzzle lover who finds joy in life’s little challenges. She’s often found laughing, as she loves to incorporate humour into everything she does, lightening the mood wherever she goes. Her best friend, Mathu, frequently convinces Taylor to read her favourite books, though Taylor admits she’s still working on that long reading list!

Mathu Vijayakumar (she/her) is a 4th-year Bachelor of Social Work (BSW) student at Trent University Durham GTA, where she brings her unique perspective as a transfer, first-generation, and mature student to her academic journey. For the past three years, Mathu has been a key part of Student Life, focusing on creating meaningful programming for Summer Kickstart, Orientation, and Certificate programs. She’s led and trained Orientation Leaders and Captains, coordinated weekly on-campus events, and worked closely with the Trent Durham Student Association to bring events to life.

Currently, Mathu is completing her social work placement in Malvern, the community where she grew up. There, she facilitates psychoeducation workshops alongside a counsellor, covering topics like mental health, consent, and youth advocacy for middle and high school students. These workshops aim to foster resilience, self-awareness, and empowerment. Mathu is passionate about working with equity-deserving groups and amplifying marginalized voices, striving to create spaces for advocacy and change.

In her downtime, Mathu enjoys reading thrillers and romance novels, is currently tackling swimming lessons, and can often be found FaceTiming her dynamic duo, Taylor Uroda. She firmly believes in the power of community, humour, and the occasional good book to keep life balanced and fulfilling.

Connect with Taylor Uroda: Email | Linkedin
Connect with Mathu Vijayakumar: Email | Linkedin

Listen Now

Listen to the episode now on Apple Podcasts, S potify, or on your favourite podcast platform.

Resources Mentioned

Trent University Durham GTA

The Transcript

**Please note that all of our transcriptions come from rev.com and are 80% accurate. We’re grateful for the robots that make this possible and realize that it’s not a perfect process.

(Transcription from Rev)

Join the Educator Network & Connect with Taylor Uroda and Mathu Vijayakumar

April 10, 2025 by Sam Demma School Administration Student Student Leadership Student Success 0

Shandi Andres — State Adviser for Kansas FCCLA

About Shandi Andres

Shandi Andres is the State Adviser for Kansas FCCLA. She also serves a Family and Consumer Sciences (FCS) Education Instructor at Kansas State University. She is a recipient of the American Association of Family and Consumer Sciences (AAFCS) 2023 Leaders Award. She started her career as a FCS Teacher and FCCLA Adviser. She moved to a position as an Extension Agent. She served as a FCS & 4-H Agent while also serving as a District Director. These experiences led her to the current position.

This position allows her to work with youth and FCS professionals from across the state and nation. Shandi believes that Family and Consumer Science courses, skills, and experiences provide a foundation for individuals to succeed. FCCLA is the student organization as part of FCS in which students are able to grow as leaders and develop skills for life.

Connect with Shandi Andres: Email | Instagram | Facebook

Listen Now

Listen to the episode now on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or on your favourite podcast platform.

Resources Mentioned

Kansas FCCLA

Kansas State University

The Transcript

**Please note that all of our transcriptions come from rev.com and are 80% accurate. We’re grateful for the robots that make this possible and realize that it’s not a perfect process.

Sam Demma
Welcome back to another episode of the High Performing Educator podcast. This is your host, Sam. And today we are joined by Shandi Andres. Shandi Andres is the State Advisor for Kansas FCCLA, and she also serves as a Family and Consumer Science Educational Instructor at Kansas State University.

Sam Demma
She’s the recipient of the American Association of Family and Consumer Sciences Leadership Award in 2023. And she started her career as an FCS teacher and FCCLA advisor, which I’m sure she’ll be talking a little bit about here today. She’s also done some work with 4-H and with the district as a director.

Sam Demma
And these experiences have led her to her position today. She’s also currently in calving season. with the district as a director. And these experiences have led her to her position today. She’s also currently in calving season. And I know it’s very busy for her. Shandi, thank you so much for setting aside some time to be on the podcast here today.

Shandi Andres
Yeah, thanks Sam for having me.

Sam Demma
Tell me a little bit about what got you interested and involved in education and family consumer sciences.

Shandi Andres
So, I remember even as a little kid thinking that I wanted to be a teacher. Many fellow educators, you know, when they were little, they probably had their siblings set up and playing school, etc. And that was no different at my house. However, the biggest difference was I didn’t want to teach math, I didn’t want to teach reading. So I knew I wanted to be a teacher, but I didn’t really know what I wanted to teach. And it wasn’t until I got to high school, my freshman year, one of my best friends drug me into the organization fair and her aunt was the FCCLA teacher and FACTS or FCCLA advisor and FACTS teacher and she drug me in and she said, hey, we should do this. And I said, okay. So I signed up and I was actually enrolled in a facts class that semester. And what I found was that I found my home. I grew up with an ag background, absolutely love ag, grew up in 4-H. But I found my home in FCS.

Shandi Andres
That’s the acronym we use for family and consumer sciences. So you’ll hear people say FACTS, you’ll hear people say FCS, but it all comes down to the same. And so my high school career, I took as many family and consumer science classes as I could. I was a chapter officer, star event participant, district officer, and really launched my desire to be a FACS teacher. So by the time I was a junior, I was committed to being a FACS teacher and that’s kind of continued with my path of family and consumer sciences.

Sam Demma
What was it specifically about family and consumer sciences versus the other subject areas that really drew you in or pulled you in?

Shandi Andres
No, it was skills that everybody could use every day. When we think about, yes, we need math. We really do. You know, kids don’t necessarily see that they need math, but I can tell you exactly how we use it. You know, when don’t necessarily see that they need math, but, but I can tell you exactly how we use it. You know, when I am going to make a recipe and it’s written as a single recipe, but I want to quadruple it because I’m serving a larger group, then I can calculate that out in my head because I know how fractions work and how our, our math works. So it’s real life skills. It’s also skills like communication and public speaking that we grow and develop through our time in those family and consumer science classes. And so if you think about our careers, we have a lot of careers in the new career cluster model and previously that are connected to family and consumer sciences, but our skills that we learn in family and consumer sciences launch us into any career, help us to be better people and to be better consumers. If we think about family and consumer sciences, we can break that down. So anything that involves us as being a member of a family, and that means as a member of the family, we’re a member of the community.

Shandi Andres
But also then we think about consumerism and how do we make better decisions as consumers. And so that might mean when I buy a car, how do I choose that process and that purchase to make the best choice for me? But it could also mean that how do I choose a banking product or how do I choose my insurance? And so all of those impact us as individuals. and FCCLA is that I’m going to call it professional development component for students in the area of the family and consumer sciences but when I’m talking to potential students or teachers, parents about our program then a lot of times I get well what can I do if I don’t want to be in family and consumer sciences.

Shandi Andres
We have a lot of components that are just about making making yourself better. One of our national programs is the power of one and so it really is about you personally. How do we how do we make ourselves better? When we think about power of one, then it has modules within it. So one of them is a better you. And so you set personal goals for yourself to be able to improve something about you. One of them is a family tie. So maybe that means that you want to improve our relationship with your mom or dad. Working on working, so I’m going to prepare for a career, how do I do that? Take the lead and then speak out for FCCLA. Those are just, that’s just a very basic program within FCCLA and so it’s applicable to anyone. Our competitive events are the same way. When we think about maybe you want to be in a family and consumer science-related career, but maybe you don’t.

Shandi Andres
And if you don’t, there’s still competitive events and story events like leadership or career investigation that are very much just about you and not necessarily about a family and consumer science science related career.

Sam Demma
Tell me about your first experience with FCCLA.

Shandi Andres
I don’t know if I can tell you my very first experience. But I do know that I was part of our chapter. So that’s the basic unit building blocks within the organization. So our chapter was in our high school. And so we had a chapter there where I went to high school. And so we had monthly meetings.

Shandi Andres
Those monthly meetings allowed me to see how parliamentary procedure was used in a business meeting beyond just knowing Robert’s Rules of Order, how do we use it. But then we also planned activities, community service projects. We took some of our national programs and created projects within the school and communities. I did star events. So my freshman, sophomore and junior year, I competed in the job interview of star event.

Shandi Andres
And my goal was to make it to nationals. And so I did my junior year I made it to nationals. Part of the job interview event means that you’re going to have a job that you want to apply for. You’re going to create a portfolio as if you are preparing for that job. And then you meet with the judges just like a formal interview process and they’re going to have your material.

Shandi Andres
And that was a great learning experience for me as an individual, not only to think about the preparation of that portfolio, but also then how do I efficiently communicate with the person sitting on the other side of the table, and to be able to take constructive criticism and feedback from those judges. So my junior year, I qualified for nationals, and I was able to go to nationals that year and that was that was fantastic to be able to do that. My senior year then I had to choose a different project. I couldn’t take the same events so I had to I did something different but but that created that process created a lot of opportunities for connections but in personal growth. The one year I was working on my job interview event and we actually had a parliamentary procedure team from our chapter. And so that team actually worked, they met a lot.

Shandi Andres
They usually met two or three times a week to go through their practice. And one of our chapter members that was on the Parlipro team that year actually was diagnosed with diabetes during the preparation. And so to see the connections that happen beyond just school and classroom for those for my friends and those fellow students was just amazing and we don’t create those connections when we’re just just

Sam Demma
attending class. It sounds like every touch point you’ve had with FCCLA has been an impactful one. Whether you were the student or the advisor, or just involved at an event. Why do you think it’s important that more students get involved in experiences like FCCLA or FCS?

Shandi Andres
Well, one of them I think that’s really important is connection. You know, our students when in middle school and high school really need that connection. Yes, they need that connection with their peers, but they also need that connection with an adult in their building. And so when we participate in extracurricular or intercurricular activities, then we actually help build those connections and students do better in school. FCCLA, depending on who you ask, would say, or most of the time we would say that it is intercurricular. So the hope is that all of those advisors are using the FCCLA materials within their classroom. And then sometimes it becomes extracurricular because you have students who really want to take it above and beyond. But it is designed to be intercurricular. And yes, it does take a little time outside of class if you are doing well within your chapter.

Sam Demma
What part in your journey did you also start serving at Kansas State University?

Shandi Andres
So when I was fresh out of high school, or out of college, I actually attended Kansas State University. And then when I was fresh out of college, I took a teaching position. So I taught in a family and consumer science program in a multi-teacher department. So there were two of us and served as the FECLA advisor. I had my two children and my husband and I made the decision that I was going to leave the classroom so I could stay home and so I stayed home with my kids for a couple of years. My husband was managing an Angus operation. And so then our family process, I actually went to work full time on the ranch for five years. And when we moved home, we were living about two hours from where we grew up.

Shandi Andres
So when we moved home, I took a position with K-State Research and Extension. And if you’re not familiar with extension, extension is associated with the land grant universities, oftentimes called cooperative extension. And in Kansas, that’s housed through K-State. And so I became a Kansas State University employee when I joined K-State Research and Extension as an agent. And so I was the Family and Consumer Science and 4-H agent for the district. And I was with them for six and a half years. I took over as interim director during my time and then I went to director.

Shandi Andres
And I absolutely loved Extension and I loved 4-H. And we all have paths in our journey and part of my journey included a change. And so I, technically I changed job, but I’m still employed through Kansas State University. So I moved from my position with extension, which was out in the county. To campus and so I’m housed at Kansas State University. And my position is a 2 part position. So, I, I am employed on campus and so 20% of my contract is for teaching. That’s the family and consumer science education instructor. And so I teach our methods course for our students who are going to be family and consumer science teachers.

Sam Demma
Oh, wow.

Shandi Andres
Yeah. So I get to work with our pre-service teachers. And so in the fall, I methods and supervise practicum. And then in the spring I supervise student teaching for those students. And so making their placements out in the field and matching them up and doing their supervisions. And I work with our student organization for FACS Ed. And then the rest of my time is spent as the Kansas FCLA state advisor. And that is a contract through our state Department of Education. So they contract out our state advisors. And so that happens to be the other part of my position. I I love the combination of my position. I love that I still get to work with professionals in the field. I get to help prepare our students as they’re entering the classroom. And then I get to work with our state officers and planning our state events. So that’s the state advisor role. So I serve as an administrative function for the organization. And then I help work with our state officers and help plan leadership trainings at state events and get to see all of it come together every time. And so that’s really an amazing process and a rewarding part of my job.

Sam Demma
When you speak about it, it’s so clear that you’re passionate about all of the roles because it sounds like you could talk about them forever and you light up and you’re smiling the whole time. When you think of the advisors you had, is there any that still are front and center in your mind?

Shandi Andres
Well, I just had one FCCLA advisor. My chapter advisor was there the whole time. And she’s actually now a cousin by marriage. My husband and I started dating before I started high school. And his mom and my teacher’s husband were first cousins. And so I got to know her through class, but also outside.

Shandi Andres
And so what I appreciated about her as an advisor was her willingness to let students take the lead, jump in for pretty much anything. We were able to toss at her. But also her passion for family, for sciences, and for teaching. She was very animated, very structured in her classroom, and so I really appreciated those dynamics.

Shandi Andres
She has since left the classroom, but obviously we still still chat. And it did make a huge difference and an impact on on what I was going to do. And it was a simple ask of, hey, because you know you could do this as a career. And sometimes we have interactions with great people, but they don’t necessarily see their potential. And so as teachers, as adults working with youth, sometimes it means a simple observation of, hey, have you considered this for your career? Or have you considered looking at this? Because I think you’d be great at it.

Shandi Andres
And I think that’s really important as we think about choose preparing, choosing, advocating for teachers is how do we grow that profession? How do we encourage those youths to capture and take hold of their natural interest?

Sam Demma
It sounds like one of the ways you support young people is by acknowledging their own greatness through suggestions of pathways that they could pursue based on your observations. When it comes to building relationships with young people, supportive relationships, both with FCCLA or in the classroom, what else do you think makes all the difference when it comes to connecting with the young person?

Shandi Andres
Sometimes it’s simply them knowing that you are available, that you care, that you understand, but also sometimes that means picking up on the little things. I have our state president right now and she’s actually been on our state officer team for two years. And so she traveled with me to one of our events. And in one, she’s very, very, very good about writing thank you notes. Thank you notes following the event. And that’s one of the things that she excels at. But in one of her

Shandi Andres
thank you notes, she commented about like, thanks for always having a listening ear and for having gum to chew on when I need it. So sometimes it’s the little things that you capture. One of our training events this last fall, we usually go, I usually take our state officers, part of their training, but also advocacy

Shandi Andres
opportunities is to go to Capital Leadership, which is held in DC. And it didn’t happen this last year because of the election year. And so we went to a different training, one at the Fall Leadership Institute, and that was actually a partnership with Disney this year. So they went and did the leadership training with Disney, and then as a bonus, then they got to go to the Disney theme park to check it out.

Sam Demma
Oh, wow.

Shandi Andres
One of my state officers was very adamant that he doesn’t like roller coasters. He skipped out on the Incredicoaster. But he had his sights set on Space Mountain. He was going to go on Space Mountain while we were there. If you’re not familiar, Space Mountain is a roller coaster inside.

Sam Demma
Dark.

Shandi Andres
Dark.

Sam Demma
Yeah.

Shandi Andres
It’s absolutely dark. So we convinced him that he could go on their runaway rail car with us. And he ended up, our group got split. So we had a group at the front and a group at the back. And when we got done, he survived and he had a smile on his face. But he told me that he was going to ride with me on Space Mountain. And I said, okay. And he goes, because you laugh on the roller coasters and that makes me feel better. And I was at the front, yes, I laugh on roller coasters. And I said, you could hear me? And he goes, yeah, I could hear your laugh on the roller coaster.

Shandi Andres
And so it was something that I do naturally and I didn’t think about it. But his statement made me think about how sometimes we do little things that others pay attention to and capture onto that we don’t. It does have an impact on others, positive or negative. I think that’s important to remember. But in this case, it made me smile and it made my heart happy to hear him, hear him, um, take that in a positive light instead of negative.

Sam Demma
Oh, my, my laugh sounds like a flock of dying geese. So we’re the same people can recognize it from some ways away. And you’re so right. Sometimes the things that we take for granted are the things, not even maybe take for granted, but the things we don’t even recognize are the things that other people appreciate the most.

Sam Demma
And I think that’s what’s so unique about education or working with young people is you never really know what’s going to connect and make a difference, but you show up with the intention every single day to be of service and support and help and trust that something will connect and will make an impact. It’s been such a pleasure chatting with you. I can’t believe the time has already flown by. If some educator is, you know, an educator is listening to this, they might be struggling right now or a little bit burnt out. What advice would you give a colleague or someone else in education who’s just going through a lot right now?

Shandi Andres
I would say I have two parts to this. One of them is to remember your why, because your why, if you can remember that, will usually help you get through some of those tough times, but also remind us like, what’s your purpose? Why did you get into this? Or, why do you hope to help others with? What’s your why? That’s the first one. The second thing is, I think today, even more than ever, it’s really important to remember that we practice some self-care. Maybe that means that we take our calendar and we write it, make sure we have white space. If you’re not familiar with white space,

Shandi Andres
I use a paper calendar intentionally because I can see if I have any white space on my day and that’s me. But making sure that we have some white space for ourselves, for our own time or know where those boundaries are. But also maybe it’s the little thing.

Shandi Andres
Maybe that means there’s a song that’s your pick me up. Maybe that means there’s a scent that is your go-to. Maybe that’s a candle you can keep close. Maybe that’s a perfume or a spray. But something that reminds you, even when days are tough, to take a deep breath. And what’s the good? And let the bad go. Breathe it out. And so I think those two parts are really important as we take care of ourselves as educators and to be able to give back to our profession.

Sam Demma
I got a lot of green space and yellow space and red space and blue space. I got to find some white space, Shandi. I appreciate you so much for taking the time to share some of your journey and beliefs around education and impacting young people.

Sam Demma
I look forward to meeting you shortly. I’m so excited to be of service and support to Kansas FCCLA. If there is an educator listening to this that wants to reach out and ask you a question, what would be the best way for them to get in touch? You can reach me at my email.

Shandi Andres
So that’s sdandres@ksu.edu.

Sam Demma
Awesome. Thank you so much for your time and keep up the amazing work you’re doing.

Shandi Andres
Thanks, Sam. Hope to see you in April.

Join the Educator Network & Connect with Shandi Andres

April 3, 2025 by Sam Demma Education Educator State Advisor Student Leadership Student Success 0

Leanne Forrest — Program Manager for Educational Assistants at the Ottawa-Carleton District School Board

About Leanne Forrest

Leanne Forrest, is the Program Manager for Educational Assistants at the Ottawa-Carleton District School Board. Her career has spanned over 35 years in special education. She was nominated in 2022-2023 for the Ronald K. Lynch Award for an outstanding and significant contribution reflecting either a sustained compassionate and dedicated commitment by an OCDSB employee to the success of students with special education needs.

She began her career as an Educational Assistant supporting students with autism in specialized program classes, then joined the central Learning Support Services team for Autism. As more leadership roles became available, Leanne moved into the role of Applied Behavior Analysis Coordinator and then became the first Program Manager of Educational Assistants in 2024 at the OCDSB.

Connect with Leanne Forrest: Email | Linkedin

Listen Now

Listen to the episode now on Apple Podcasts, S potify, or on your favourite podcast platform.

Resources Mentioned

Ottawa-Carleton District School Board

Bonus Q&A with Leanne Forrest

1. Why do you do the work you do with young people?

I’m drawn to working with young people, and particularly in special education, because I believe every child deserves the chance to thrive. I’ve seen firsthand the incredible potential that exists with our students, regardless of the challenges they face. It’s about looking beyond the labels and diagnoses, and seeing the individual – their strengths, their passions, and their unique way of learning. For me, special education isn’t just about accommodations and modifications; it’s about building genuine connections, understanding each student’s specific needs, and creating a learning environment where they feel safe, supported, and empowered to reach their full potential.

It’s also about the staff who support these young people. A lot of my work now revolves around supporting Educational Assistants who walk alongside students each and every day supporting their mental health, social, communication and learning needs.

2. What got you into this work?

My path to this role was driven by a deep belief in the power of inclusive education and ensuring our students with special education needs were met. I’ve seen firsthand how dedicated teachers and EAs can transform a student’s experience, providing not only academic support but also a sense of belonging, safety and joy. I was inspired by their compassion and commitment, and I wanted to be part of a system that supports these incredible individuals and amplifies their impact.

How it all began for me:

When I was 16 years old I had an opportunity to do a volunteer placement at a specialized school in our district for students with developmental disabilities. I had never been in an environment like this and was in awe of the students’ needs and how the educators supporting them were positive and passionate about what they were doing. I found a place where I felt I belonged, where I shared the same joy in giving back, and pride in seeing students reach their full potential. I knew from that time on I wanted to work in special education.

It led me to pursue my post secondary education in supporting students with special education needs. Through my education I experienced another life changing student placement opportunity where I worked in a specialized class for students with Autism. Supporting and learning from some of our most vulnerable

students with complex needs gave me a sense of purpose and drive to do more. In these environments you are surrounded by caring and dedicated staff invested in creating safe and caring spaces to welcome students where they are at.

3. What challenges are you currently faced with?

With my new role as the Program Manager of Educational Assistants, one of the ongoing challenges is ensuring we have adequate staffing to meet the growing needs of our students. Finding and retaining qualified EAs is crucial. Another challenge is providing consistent and relevant professional development to keep EAs up-to-date on best practices and specialized skills and ensure EAs feel valued.

4. How are you overcoming those challenges?

We’re actively working on several fronts. Our HR department has implemented targeted recruitment strategies to attract qualified candidates.

We’re actively working on developing mentorship programs to support new EAs and help them thrive in their roles.

We’re developing partnerships with local colleges and universities to create pathways into the field of education assistance.

And we’re continually seeking feedback from EAs themselves to understand their needs and address them effectively. Staff feedback is crucial to understanding not only the barriers they face in the work they do but also an amazing way to gain insight and suggestions from those doing the work.

It is also about elevating the job and bringing awareness and appreciation of the work they do. You were a large part of sharing in the recognition of the important work EAs do when you joined us in August for the EA Leaning days.

We’ve also just had our first EA appreciation day back in November and I will continue to strive to bring recognition and support to the role of EAs across our district.

5. What programs did you run last year that were a success with students and teachers?

Last year we ran a number of After School Social Skills Development Programs for neurodiverse students who were having difficulty with play skills in Primary

grades as well as a program called PEERS for Intermediate and High School students who were having trouble making and keeping friends.

Both programs gave students the opportunity to learn vital play and social skills in a safe and caring environment where they could take chances and build skills and peer relationships. Teachers got the opportunity to focus on important skills, learn the evidence based strategies to elicit the skills and build connections with students they may not have already had.

6. What gives you hope? What do you think is the biggest opportunity right now?

What gives me hope right now is the unwavering dedication and passion of our Educational Assistants. In my new role I have had the privilege to walk alongside EAs who are doing remarkable things for students.

They are truly amazing individuals who go above and beyond for their students every day. The biggest opportunity right now is to elevate the profession of Educational Assistants. By providing more training, support, and recognition, we can attract and retain top talent, ensuring that every student has access to the support they need to succeed. I think there’s a growing recognition of the vital role EAs play, and I’m excited about the future.

7. What mistakes have you made and learned from that are worth sharing?

Early in my career, I wanted to be the fixer. I wanted to solve the issues. I didn’t always take time to listen and reflect before trying to solve an issue. Through my leadership courses and some amazing mentors in my career I have learned the importance of this.

You know System Principal Deb Lyon, she has been an amazing mentor to me and helped me understand the power of listening to others and taking the time to reflect. You don’t have to react immediately and make suggestions, you can give others time with their own questions to reflect and maybe come up with the solution before you make a suggestion. I find it really empowers others.

I have also learned the importance of surrounding yourself with people who not only share your values and views but the importance of being around those whose views differ from yours, who add the diversity and creativity that makes the process of collaboration so important.

I’ve also learned the importance of student voice, parent/guardian voices alongside our educators in the decisions we make. We can’t make decisions

about them without them. We can’t make lasting, supportive change unless we include the voice of everyone involved.

8. What is your motivator (or your driver)?

“My motivator is seeing the positive impact our educators have on students’ lives. It’s not easy work but they do it anyway. Knowing that I’m playing a role in supporting these dedicated individuals and ultimately helping students thrive is what drives me every day. It’s about creating a more inclusive and equitable education system where every student and staff member feel valued and supported.

9. Tell me a story about a situation where you heard the impact a program had on a student.

As I mentioned earlier, in our After School Social Skills Development Programs part of my role was to train staff to run the programs at their schools. When I would do onsite visits I would hear first hand how students were building play skills and making connections with one another. I would see the excitement and joy staff had in running the programs and feeling like they were really getting to know their students and building connections with them. They would tell me it was the best part of their day!

I had a parent stop me and tell her how her son in Kindergarten was playing with others for the first time and asked when the program would be running again so they could keep making friends.

In our PEERS program I had a student who for the first time walked home with a peer, got invited to a hangout at someone’s house and felt like he had a friend. It may not seem like a lot but for many this is the difference of wanting to come to school, having a sense of belonging and can really support their mental health and well being.

10. Where can other educators reach you if they want to bounce ideas around?

I’m always happy to connect with others. They can reach me by email at leanne.forrest@ocdsb.ca or through my linked in account. I believe in the power of collaboration and sharing best practices, and I’m always open to discussing new ideas and approaches to supporting students and EAs. As I am still new to the role and not sure if other boards have a similar position, if there’s anyone out there that supports educational assistants in their boards I’d love to connect.

Join the Educator Network & Connect with Leanne Forrest

April 1, 2025 by Sam Demma Administrative Support Education Education Assistant OCDSB Program Manager Uncategorized 0

Callie Sue Costello – Senior at Centennial High School, Boise, Idaho and Idaho FCCLA State President

About Callie Sue Costello

Callie Sue Costello is a dedicated senior at Centennial High School in Boise, Idaho, and has been an active member of the Family, Career, and Community Leaders of America (FCCLA) since her freshman year. Currently serving as the Idaho FCCLA State President, Callie has demonstrated exemplary leadership, compassion, and empathy in her work with her peers and the community. These values are at the core of her work within FCCLA, where she has focused on building strong connections with others, as she believes that relationships are the foundation of meaningful change.

Callie Sue has a deep passion for Family and Consumer Sciences (FCS), which has inspired her plans to attend Boise State University (BSU) in the fall to pursue a degree in Early Childhood Education. With aspirations of becoming a teacher, she is committed to making a positive impact on the lives of children and their families.

One of Callie Sue’s most defining traits is her resilience—she never gives up. Whether it’s through her leadership in FCCLA or her personal academic pursuits, Callie is determined to face challenges head-on and continues to inspire those around her with her perseverance and dedication.

Connect with Callie Sue Costello: Email | Instagram

Listen Now

Listen to the episode now on Apple Podcasts, S potify, or on your favourite podcast platform.

Resources Mentioned

Centennial High School

Family, Career, and Community Leaders of America (FCCLA)

Idaho FCCLA

Boise State University (BSU)

The Transcript

**Please note that all of our transcriptions come from rev.com and are 80% accurate. We’re grateful for the robots that make this possible and realize that it’s not a perfect process.

Sam Demma
Welcome back to another episode of the High Performing Educator Podcast. This is your host, Sam Demma, and today we are joined by Callie Sue Costello. Callie, a senior at Centennial High School in Boise, Idaho, currently serves as the Idaho FCCLA State President after being actively involved in the organization since her freshman year. Her leadership within Family, Career, and Community Leaders of America reflects her core values of compassion and relationship building as catalysts for meaningful change. With a deep passion for family and consumer sciences, Callie plans to attend Boise State University to pursue early childhood education, channeling her notable resilience and determination into her goal of becoming a teacher who positively impacts children and families. She is also one of the most persistent and dedicated people that I know. Callie, thank you for taking the time to be on the show here today. Please, tell me a little bit about your experience as a student and how it got you involved in FCCLA.

Callie Sue
So, back like four years ago when I was a little baby freshman, I took a class called leadership. And at the time we had a student teacher, Mr. Montana, who is now my like FCC advisor. My advisor like there’s like the lead teacher that was Ms. Berglund. She’s like my first advisor and I love her to death and she moved away so that after my freshman year. I took leadership and that class is tied in with FCCLA. So you do projects with for FCCLA in that class and then it just like you get created on that you get tied about FCCLA. You could say hey come to this event let’s go. And you get a day out of school pay 20 bucks to go You know, it’s a day at school. I didn’t care what I was missing And then I took that as okay like like this is gonna be fun because I wanted to be a part of something Knowing myself. I’m not someone that doesn’t try hard. I’m not someone that just gives up on something. So I wanted to I wanted to be an essay so I make a change. So my freshman year I was a chapter officer so for like for my school um which is just Centennial I was the first VP so I took all the notes for the meeting and just hope if the president was gone and then I said okay I want to do more this is not enough for me I’m not doing anything and then I ran for um district so a little bit bigger part of Idaho, and I did PR. So social media, Instagram, Facebook, that was fun, but I wanted to do more. And I said, I’m not gonna stop there. And then my sophomore to junior year, I ran for state officer, that was my first term. And I did PR again, because it’s a little bit more like the bigger scale, state officer is a big step. You go through all the crazy speeches in front of all the 500 people at the state conference and the nerve-wracking just everything about running for the office is crazy. Makes you want to cry. And then last year I wanted to run one more time for my senior year and I was elected as the state president for ILO at CCLA against, and I have a team of eight right now, so I am meeting I’m getting asking to our conference in April.

Sam Demma
Tell me a little bit about wanting to be a part of something. I think that is a desire that everyone has, you know, and tell me how FCCLA kind of filled that desire or want.

Callie Sue
Um, well, I think growing up, my mom said, you’re going to be able to, you’re going to do something, Kelly. She always said, you wear your heart on your sleeve. You care for everybody. You need to, you need to do something with that, like with your passion. And so, at CCLA, I learned, I found my love for being a teacher. Within the CCLA, I just competed in a project a couple of months ago about positive guidance for children, and that is teaching teachers how to be a better teacher. And looking at me, who is a little baby high schooler that doesn’t have a college degree or anything that just has worked with time and been involved with leadership and connection and communication. It’s like I can make a change on a student through talking to a teacher in a different way. And from the consumer sciences is really what that is, is connection and leadership. And basically what you need to do, you need to have SES to even do a lot of basic things, like cooking and getting dressed every day, you need to have SES to do that.

Callie Sue
And so I think being able to make a change through, like even like when I met you and I introduced you to my team, like that was like, I made a change of like, hey, like we can get this guy. He’s crazy. Like we can bring him, because everyone on the team said, no, you can’t do that. You can’t, you can’t make him, you can’t pull him onto our team. I was like, no, no, no, no, no. Just watch. And that’s why I’m just very persistent. And I don’t like giving up and that’s the way that I make a change. I feel like it’s because I’m setting the bar higher than someone else. Maybe not. Maybe I think I reached that bar and you know, and I’m going to be the one that says, no, I’ll try. Just watch. I’ll try.

Sam Demma
For context, for everyone listening, Callie saw me speak at a conference in Boise. I wanna say it was last November. Two years ago, me. Two years ago. And decided, you know,

Callie Sue
Sam, it’d be awesome to have you come and speak at our event as well. The event is a little bit of a smaller size event. So the team probably told her, there’s no way it’s gonna work out. Logistically, it’s not gonna be possible. And she drafted up letters for local businesses and rallied support and I was blown away by it all and we found this cool win-win-win scenario and I’m going back to Boise as a result. So you really are very persistent and I applaud you on it and hope that that’s something you carry forward for the rest of your life.

Sam Demma
You mentioned you’re not in college yet or have a degree, but you’ve had so much experience working with young people. When it comes to building relationships with students and youth, that’s what every teacher wants to do.

Callie Sue
What do you think is most important? I think I have a twin brother, because some people don’t know that about me. We are very, very opposite. Like I am the one that wants to go, go, go and keep trying. He’s like, no problem, I’m just giving up. So I think people mistake him to be me. And I’m like, no, no, no, no, no, I’m Kallie Sue. I’m not him. I love him, he’s my brother. But I want to be different. And so my teacher, cause she both of us are in her class, she’s like, what is, you get to think like, yeah, we’re twins.

Callie Sue
But I think her connecting with me and seeing that I could do more is what I wanted to do for little children. A lot of little kids, this is like teacher language. If you have a kid that’s like a problem child or like a challenging behavior, people just give up. And they want to say, no, if I can’t teach this classroom, I don’t want to do it. I can’t continue being a teacher in here. I say, no, I’ll go in there and I’ll do it. Because you can’t give up on a child. They just need help. Every form of behavior is a way of communicating something. People don’t see it like that. And I’m like, no, no, no, no, no, look at it. Maybe because the teacher in there hasn’t been consistent enough with whatever they’re doing. It’s a fallout on what you shouldn’t you’re not doing and that’s what they’re reacting in that way But some people tell me I’m just crazy and I know nothing But I’m like, no, no, no, like look at it like the situation like it’s not I Know I go on but when I talked about my workshop, I taught my boss That used to work for did love me talking about that because I’m just a kid. I was like, no, but I don’t want to be more than a kid. I want to be seen as someone that wants to help help your staff and wants to help those kids in that class because I love those kids and they’re not mine, but I love them. And I don’t want to be seen as like a threat. I want to be seen as a teacher that just wants to help somebody. And that’s why I think like having the change and not giving up is what I am fond of or what I usually try to aim for because that’s what children deserve and that’s what like adults deserve too is like to not be giving up on.

Sam Demma
You’re gonna make such a big contribution to so many young people, I can already feel it.

Callie Sue
I wanna teach kindergarten one day. High schoolers in me and I’m not a fan of high school. And at kindergarten, like that age is just beautiful and they’re learning how to be a big kid. And I just love that, because I loved being a big kid when I was little, like getting into elementary school and seeing what I could do with what I want, like what stuff I could pick that day or what my friends I saw, just being a part of that is what I want to inspire and change.

Sam Demma
Something I have to share with a lot of my friends and younger people in my life is that age doesn’t determine ability. Sometimes it does, but for example, you could have a 60-year-old person who’s never taken a professional photo in their life and a 13-year-old student who’s been taking photos with a professional camera for two years. This young person who’s been taking photos for two years has more experience with professional photography than the 60 year old. Just because you have age doesn’t mean you have experience with something.

Sam Demma
You can be a young person obsessed with helping young people and be more obsessed with that than someone twice your age. And just because you are younger, it doesn’t mean your input, your insights, your ideas aren’t valuable. So never forget that. I think you’re going to make a big impact.

Callie Sue
I think that’s why I love FCC so much is because I get to make decisions. I get to be a part of that and say things. Like we just picked our gifts, everyone gets it. Like at a conference, like I got to be a part of that. And it’s like just making little decisions to put like our conference together and to put like a lesson plan, what I want to put together, like you’re just like being a part of that. And then she said like let me be a leader and like I have people like this one on my team now that ran because of me. Like she ran because she saw me at BASIC and teach a conference and a workshop about communication. Like that to me, just like okay, like I’m doing something right. I’m not, I’m not feeling, I’m not stupid, I’m not dumb, I’m doing something right. That touched her and said, I can be an officer just like how I do.

Sam Demma
Wow, you know, you’re balancing a lot. School responsibilities, FCCLA responsibilities, other things in life. There’s a teacher listening to this doing the same. Balancing teaching, balancing extracurricular activities, balancing life at home.

Sam Demma
Sometimes they get extremely overwhelmed and a little bit burnt out. And I’m sure you’ve had that experience at some point in your life. What advice do you have for teachers who might be going through that? Take it a day at a time.

Callie Sue
My person, like my boyfriend is terrible at managing everything. He just wants to break down and cry. And I’m like, okay, I’m like, okay. Like I had two binders for my class, for my SDS class. I’m like, okay, one day at a time. I’m really good at making like a list of what I need to do right now. And then other things they’ll just fall. They will just fall into your day. If you’re up till 1am that’s okay. I don’t recommend that because you need sleep. But take it a day at a time and it will all go the way you want it to. It may seem crazy. You may want to cry for five minutes to ten minutes but then make a list and realize what you need to do right now what’s most important for you or your students that day and then everything else would just fall into place. Where did you get all this wisdom from at such a young age? Because I’ve done a lot because I um I think I taught me a lot of that. I think I taught me time management when I have a deadline that I have to meet and I’m in a set deadline, I’m like, oh, okay, I need to do that. And then I’m a daughter and a sibling and a girlfriend and a friend and a peer and a teacher at my work. And it’s just, I used to laugh at my mom a lot. Maybe when you meet my mom, you’ll learn how I act. But she has shown me to never give up. And that’s, I think, where I get it all from because you give up and you’re saying that, that you’re weak, I guess in a way, or that you, not weak is not the right word, but if you give up, you’re letting whatever’s in front of you become way too big of it needs to be. And don’t let don’t want to be a cloud over your head. Just keep going. The rain cloud will go behind you and it’s okay.

Sam Demma
One of my friends always told me the worst time to stop is in the middle of the storm. If you’re going through a storm, don’t stop, keep going to get to the other side of it, you know?

Sam Demma
And it sounds like that’s been a common theme throughout your life. I’m curious, when you think of other caring adults who’ve had a big impact on you, it sounds like your mom has been foundational. Who else has had a big impact and what specifically did they do for you?

Callie Sue
Right now I’m in an early childhood class at Moravian High School. I’m going to get my CDA and her name is Miss Phillips and I have known Miss Phillips since I was a baby freshman and I met her when I ran for state officer as well and I’d become her student. That’s where I bug her and she’s annoyed at me because I went to her so much now but um before I ran for state president I called her bawling my eyes out crying because I didn’t think I could do it I didn’t have the support really from the people that I wanted to have support from and I was told that I can’t do it and I’m gonna fail and I can’t juggle at all I said no no no okay so I called myself I was at Hobby Lobby doing something and I called her. I called her crying and I said, tell me I can do it. Tell me that I’m not gonna fail. I need someone to tell me that I’m not crazy. And she’s like, why are you so nervous? Because I’m just doubting what people told me and I’m doubting that I can’t do it. Because I just can’t, I want to be a state president. I cannot, that’s crazy to me. And she just listened to me and she told me that it was okay to cry and it’s okay to think about it if I chose to not run for state president, but She just listened to me. I guess was the answer to that question and she never told me like yep, you’re crazy Yep, you’re gonna fail She said you may fail and that’s okay, but it’s okay to fail. It’s okay to have a day where you are Off for your late on a deadline. It’s okay, but you can do it. And I left Hobby Lobby and sent my application in and then I went to the office and got picked for state president and here I am.

Sam Demma
One of my favorite quotes from Denzel Washington, Matthew McConaughey, there’s a few people who have said it, is that failure is the feedback you need to get closer to the goal you’re trying to achieve. And if you look at it from that perspective, it’s not a failure, it’s a stepping stone in the right direction. And without any failure, it’s unlikely you’ve ever tried. If you’re not trying, you’re not failing. If you’re trying, at some point, you’re gonna have feedback. I think it’s so important that we all keep that in mind. This advisor, Ms. Phillips, does she know how much of an impact she’s made on you?

Callie Sue
She does. I probably, I don’t tell her it enough, but I see her every other day when I’m in class and I always say I love you and she said I love you too, Callie Sue, because that to me shows that she knows just how much effect that the fact that I’ve made on her and she’s made on me. She doesn’t know a time that um some of her students are running for state officer actually this year and she goes I told them I want them I want them to beat you. They need to look up to you, Kaisu. I’m like no no no, that’s a good idea. Like like they’re gonna be like the next Kaisu like reaching for the sky like there’s no limit because that’s what you do and I’m like oh thank you. So she knows I’m gonna give her something for family year because I adore her and she never ever gives up on anybody and that’s that’s really how I love her kids too, she’s a good kid either. That’s what she’s like is a teacher for her, is what she’s offered and so she never gets, she has all these ideas of what it means to be a teacher and I just love that she never gives up on us as like an adult, a young adult or a preschooler that’s having a behavior problem.

Sam Demma
What I’m taking from this interview, especially from the perspective of an educator, is that sometimes the people in your classroom that are being impacted by your words and actions, your students, will tell you. Sometimes they might not, you know. You said, you know, maybe you don’t tell her as much as you should. And there’s some educators listening who don’t maybe all the time hear how much of an impact they’re having on their students, but it doesn’t mean the impact’s not there. I’m also taking away this idea of never giving up in all aspects of life, because the challenge that shows up, you don’t wanna give it power over you. You don’t wanna allow it to, you don’t want it to allow, you don’t wanna allow it to change the way you choose to proceed. I’m taking this idea away of shooting from the stars and recognizing that things may be difficult in the moment, but don’t stop then. You know, get through the other side of it.

Sam Demma
Take it day by day. Control what you can control. Is there anything else you’d want to say to any student or educator listening? This has been such a lovely conversation.

Callie Sue
You will get there. You may have some dream, make it your reality. My dream is to be a teacher one day and I just got enrolled in college to be a teacher. So never ever give up for the stars like you said and If you cry, that’s okay. It’s okay to cry for five minutes, but keep going and don’t ever give up.

Sam Demma
Cali Sue, thank you so much for taking the time to come on the podcast here today.

Callie Sue
Of course.

Sam Demma
I’ll see you in Boise.

Callie Sue
Oh my gosh, yes I will, bye.

Join the Educator Network & Connect with Callie Sue Costello

March 27, 2025 by Sam Demma Education President Student Leadership Student Success 0

Janis Volker – School Counselor at Chetek-Weyerhaeuser High School/Middle School

About Janis Volker

Janis Volker is the School Counselor for grades 6-12 at Chetek-Weyerhaeuser High School/Middle School. She started in the district in 2004 as the elementary counselor and spent 4 years at Roselawn Elementary School. In September 2008 she transitioned to the high school/middle school, making this her 21st year in the district. Prior to entering education she was a program coordinator for Barron County Restorative Justice for two years. That experience working with law enforcement, schools, and community members was a wonderful foundation to school counseling. She felt honored to be present with victims and offenders that worked to heal the harm that was caused.

In the high school/middle school she has many roles that support students, including the coordination of the Early College Credit, Advanced Placement, Start College Now, and Youth Apprenticeship programs. On a daily basis she is assisting students with their academic and career planning, college applications, scholarships, and providing individual counseling and SEL classroom instruction. She coordinates the ASVAB Career Exploration program and the PSAT/NMSQT, as well as assisting with the proctoring of state assessments. Behind every successful program and initiative at school is a team that works together to get everything accomplished. No one does it alone.

Advising students on their next steps and encouraging them to explore dual credit courses to earn college credits in high school are some of her favorite experiences working with students. Seeing the growth, both academically and socially, from year to year and celebrating them as they cross the stage at graduation; are some of the most rewarding days. She is proud to work in her district that is so supportive of students, families, and staff.

Connect with Janis Volker: Email | Instagram | Linkedin | Twitter

Listen Now

Listen to the episode now on Apple Podcasts, S potify, or on your favourite podcast platform.

Resources Mentioned

Chetek-Weyerhaeuser High School/Middle School

Roselawn Elementary School

Barron County Restorative Justice

The Transcript

**Please note that all of our transcriptions come from rev.com and are 80% accurate. We’re grateful for the robots that make this possible and realize that it’s not a perfect process.

Sam Demma
Welcome back to another episode of the High Performing Educator Podcast. This is your host, Sam, and today we are joined by Janis Volker. Janis has been in education and counseling for a total of 21 years. She has worked in the middle school age bracket, the high school age bracket, and the elementary school age bracket. Janis and I will cross paths here shortly in her school district.

Sam Demma
And I’m so grateful that before I had the opportunity to chat with her. Janis, welcome to the show and thank you so much for being here.

Janis Volker
Good morning, thank you for having me.

Sam Demma
Tell us a little bit about what got you into education and wanting to support young people.

Janis Volker
Well, way back in high school, I thought I was going to be a college professor and I just had that in my mind, I’m going to be a teacher. And then I started off in college and, you know, I had a rough start. And I was once told, I don’t think your grades are going to get you into that school of education. And that really hit me hard.

Janis Volker
And it was a little bit of a wake-up call that this is serious. This is like, this is all counting, you know, I need to really figure myself out. And then I found my path down psychology and loved psychology. And that was my first degree. And then in my senior year, I discovered, oh, wow, this whole world of if I continue and get a master’s degree, I could actually work with students and help them in a way that I wanted to. And that’s how I discovered school counseling.

Sam Demma
What about psychology intrigued you?

Janis Volker
Well, I have to be honest. I think it was a lot of figuring out myself and my family and the dynamics and then also just being able to help other people. I found it fascinating, all the different theories, you know, psychotherapy. And I knew I didn’t necessarily want to do that, but I just wanted to be around students. But I didn’t think I wanted to teach.

Janis Volker
And so that’s how I found my way into the education system.

Sam Demma
It sounds like you married the best of both worlds. Work with young people, fulfill that love for psychology and supporting them with it. Tell me a little bit about after the psychology education, what happened next?

Janis Volker
I actually first started in school psychology and after just one term of it, had to do a shadowing experience with a school counselor. She was at the elementary level and I just loved her job. I thought it was, wow, look at her. She’s sitting on the floor with these stuffed animals talking to kids about their feelings. It was like, this is so much fun. And so I did that switch to school counseling right away in the program.

Janis Volker
But I think it was, you know, just, I didn’t realize when I first started college in psychology that I couldn’t probably get in front of people and help people unless I continued my education. Like the opportunities were more limited. So that’s why I decided to continue on. And I kept going. Took me a while because in that time I also was married and then became a mom myself and so didn’t take a direct path through college.

Sam Demma
Did you have a counselor in middle, high, or college that really supported you through your own transition or challenges?

Janis Volker
I definitely had people that supported me but I wasn’t one that would go and seek out help myself. So I didn’t really have that experience other than like helping with scheduling and talking about college visits and things like that. But it was a teacher of mine, a professor in my undergraduate that taught us all these career opportunities. And I think without him, I don’t know that I would have kept going. I was really thankful that he shared that with us before we graduated.

Sam Demma
You and I are very alike in the sense that we sometimes don’t go out of our way to seek the help we might need in the moment we need it. And I would argue that’s most people because of a stigma and a fear. And it may even be most students in a school building. Are there any signs or signals of distress that you look for in students to recognize if someone might need some help but are a little bit afraid to ask for it?

Janis Volker
Yes, I think there’s lots of clues. When you, as an observer, just see, you know, when someone’s going down the hallway, are they talking with other people? Are they really by themselves? You know, at lunchtime, are they with a group of friends? Are they off in a corner on their phone? Are things going on in their life that you know about, but they’re not seeking help? Have they had death in their family, repeated other kind of challenges? And then grades are a big clue.

Janis Volker
All of a sudden you see a dip, or maybe you’re not going out for the sport you always used to get involved in and things like that. So I think as long as it doesn’t have to be the school counselor that reaches out, just any adult in the building that makes connections with students. Sometimes that’s the favorite person, the person who’s doing attendance in the main office. That’s their person that they connect with, that just says good morning every single day.

Sam Demma
I had a guidance counselor who supported me in all my post-secondary applications for college and university in the United States. We were trying to figure out the eligibility requirements as a Canadian who wanted to do a Division I scholarship in the United States. And she became someone that I felt very comfortable sharing things with over my high school experience. I know that oftentimes the administrator’s office or the guidance counselor’s office can be a little bit intimidating for a young person when they walk in the door. What are some ways you help calm people down and just let them know that they’re here to be supported and it is a safe space?

Janis Volker
You know, I think I have a friendly face, right? I like to smile, I like to laugh, but my first three words are usually, when a student walks in, “You’re not in trouble.”

Janis Volker
There’s this fear of, I got called to the office and I say, you know, we do a lot of things in here. We help with your schedule. You know, we talk about college. We talk about youth apprenticeships. Like, I don’t just call people in to say there’s a problem or there’s, you know, a concern. So just trying to, you know, get to know students in different ways in the building. So to make that connection that, you know, you have to do those conversations sometimes

Janis Volker
about dress code, and then you get that reputation. She’s going to tell you you’re wearing the wrong kind of shirt today.

Sam Demma
I just remember situations when I was in school and I got called down from class at the office and I was like, oh man, this is gonna be bad. I think that’s a really good way to start the conversation just to let a student know, you’re not in trouble, we’re here to help.

Sam Demma
How do you think you build a connection with a student to the point where they really look forward to chatting with you and trust the advice or trust the guidance?

Janis Volker
I always, I mean, I’m more of an introvert to be honest. So I’m not that person that’s out there, like the super fun cheerleader, but I’m more the quiet, always supportive, always there to listen and really ask you questions about, you know, your day or your struggles. Or I like to remember certain things about a student that I can bring up the next year. You know, like I remember this when we were in seventh grade

Janis Volker
and you were talking about the careers and you said you wanted to go into welding. You know, and then I see them pursue that as they get older in high school and comment on that, you know, so that they know I’m listening, I’m aware. You know, I wish I could do that more

Janis Volker
with every single person in the building, but I think that’s really, students really, really want to be cared for. That’s, I mean, don’t we all, but it’s really important.

Sam Demma
You must have a long list of notes from all these conversations.

Janis Volker
I do, yeah, somewhere in my head, but. And at this age, sometimes they lose us, but yeah. I think the intent to remember

Sam Demma
is already a phenomenal start. It forces us to, creates a forcing function for us to pay more attention when people are talking to us, as opposed to thinking about the past or the future, which is so easy these days. Question for you, do you, or can you share a story

Sam Demma
of a student who walked into the office that was very confused, very uncertain, very overwhelmed, and after a couple years and some guidance, you just were so proud of the young person they became. And you don’t have to share their name. And the reason I ask is because

Sam Demma
there’s an educator listening to this that may be a little bit overwhelmed, or even a guidance counselor that may be a little overwhelmed, and they may have lost sight as to why they do what they do and I think that these little stories of

Sam Demma
transformation are really at the heart of why most people get into the work

Janis Volker
They do with young people. So sure. So someone comes to mind a young man who really dealt with mental health and had a lot of family struggles a lot of there was a lot of death in the family. Just you know, there was poverty. There was a little bit of everything. And he missed a lot of school.

Janis Volker
And he would have moments where he just needed to take a break from class or he wouldn’t come to school just feeling overwhelmed. And I never felt like I was making a difference because when you’re listening, I always feel in their mind, they must be thinking, I still feel just as anxious or I still have this depression like things are, I mean, things progress much slower than we all want them to.

Janis Volker
But then his senior year, he, I got a letter from him. It was a really cool activity where the seniors get to pass out letters of people that they want to thank before they graduate. And when I received that, it was one of the most meaningful things, you know, in my career. Like, wow, because I’m not I’m not in front of students as much and more in this office. I try to be out and about, but I mean, teachers, I feel, get to build those connections on a deeper level with every student than maybe I do. And it just it meant the world to me that that I was able to help and that he recognized that.

Sam Demma
I just think about all the students who have walked in your office whose lives you’ve had an impact on but who haven’t written a letter. That’s what we hope. Yeah, that’s the… It’s so funny, I did a performance last week for a high school and the audio system was not great and they swapped out four mics in the first 30 minutes.

Sam Demma
I feel like the first 30 minutes, people didn’t even hear what I was saying. And we finished the performance and we had a good number of students still rush on over and ask questions and thank us and take photos. And in my heart, I was like,

Sam Demma
I could have reached more, you know, like this was a waste, we didn’t make a difference. And this one, like the setup was not great. And then, you know, we got home and the cameraman who was with me, Matias, was like, dude, there was a couple of students that I saw who were absolutely glued and locked in despite the audio challenges. I promise you it reached some young minds. And that’s all that matters, even if they hadn’t written that letter or written that message.

Sam Demma
And just this morning, it’s been a week, I got a message from a student that was like, hey, you came to the school last week and I just wanna let you know, our friends really enjoyed it and I was like, if this ain’t the universe, just like let me know.

Sam Demma
You know, like, stop being so critical and stop judging how other people are receiving it. Just show up and do your best. Like I think that’s something that I’ve tried to carry forward with me in everything that I do. Have you ever had any moments in your work where you questioned if like, oh, is this the right work for me to be doing? And if so, how did you get through some of those

Janis Volker
Moments? Yeah, I mean, definitely the mental health piece takes a toll. And I don’t know that I’m the best at self-care. I, you know, I can tell people like, oh, you need to do this and you should be exercising and a great diet. Make sure you get out in nature. And I’ve improved in that area by developing my own hobby of photography. That became something that I felt like just relieved stress like nothing else to just be outside and at sunrise. That’s all I need really to feel better. So I think just trying to be self-aware of you need, if I ever hit that point where I’m burned out, I need to release myself because you’re not helping anyone once you reach burnout. So I guess that’s something I always think about because I have thought about, well, what would I do if I did something else?

Janis Volker
And I still think it’d be helping people. It would just be in a different scene, maybe healthcare or something, but that’s always what I want to do.

Sam Demma
Was photography something you discovered earlier in your childhood or when did that come about for you?

Janis Volker
Just being in the house and I just started observing that stay at home order we had for a few months that first spring. And so I was working from home and at the dining table and I was surrounded by windows and I thought, all these birds come to my house during the day when I’m not here. Like, wow, this is really cool. And then I just, it kind of created this, you know, interest of mine, curiosity.

Janis Volker
And then I started taking pictures and then I kept getting different cameras and then I was hooked. And then I was taking pictures every single day. So it’s, yeah.

Sam Demma
A pipe recently burst in our basement bathroom and my dad had his friend, a subcontractor named Jimmy come over to fix it. And while we were in the bathroom, I was handing him tools, he was fixing it. He started telling me about the books he had bought that morning. Did you know that you can go to a thrift store and buy a book for 50 cents? I was like, yeah, I know, I know, because I used to buy a bunch from Value Village, and he’s like, Sam, I bought seven books for $3.

Sam Demma
I was like, this is awesome, man, I’m so glad you’re excited about books. And he told me about this one book called Who Moved My Cheese by a guy named Kenneth Blanchard and he’s a business slash management author and he gave me a very high level overview of the book that there’s these two mice and one is always waiting for the cheese and the other one is always like searching for it. And that to remain curious and to keep searching for things in life is such a beautiful way to live. And you said one of the things you realized from the book is that the mice that would wait for it just live the same life over and over again. Like everything about their day was exactly the same. Whereas the mouse that was searching or curious would take different paths and try, find the cheese down different roads.

Sam Demma
And isn’t that interesting? Like COVID changed up your routine. And instead of going to work, you stayed home. As a result, you saw these beautiful birds out the window and boom, a new passion for photography came to life. I think that remaining curious is so important, not only for students, but everybody. Trying the new restaurant, taking the different route home, looking out the window and pausing for a moment. I developed some passions during the pandemic. I’m curious, like, has photography remained a part of your life?

Sam Demma
Oh, yes. Do you take a lot of pictures? Like, tell me a little bit about it

Janis Volker
Yes, I do. And the last year I haven’t as much, which is funny, that the more I tried to get into selling it, the less I actually did it. And so that was a really good lesson of, wait, you need to keep that focus on your enjoyment, like what you, what relieves the stress, which is the whole point, you know, to have something so fun. And that what I like about photography is there’s, there’s no two sunrises that are identical, like everything.

Janis Volker
There’s just no two pictures are going to look the same, just because of all the different components. And that’s the same way I love my job here is you can never predict a day in the school. And it just keeps it kind of fresh, even though it’s the same office every day, it’s very different from day to day.

Sam Demma
In your 21 year career in education, have there been any colleagues or teachers who have walked into your office and said, hey Janis, can I ask you a question? Looking for guidance.

Janis Volker
Yeah, definitely. Especially, you know, with the loss. And loss by suicide is one that when we’re growing up, we don’t really, you know, it’s something that’s not really talked about. And people don’t feel comfortable asking someone when they’ve experienced that loss. You know, people tend to avoid the really uncomfortable conversations. So when someone’s experiencing that in their family for the first time, no matter the age, you need help. You need support. So I know definitely those are times too. And just we’re struggling with, you know, just having a rough time either in school or out of school just needing someone to listen?

Sam Demma
I ask because when we were all little babies, we very openly accepted failure and recognized it as a necessary thing. How many times will a baby fail before it learns to walk? As many times as it takes and we’ll cheer them on all the way.

Sam Demma
But then at a certain age, a child starts to believe that it’s not acceptable to make a mistake. It’s not acceptable to fail. And then I think as that child grows up and becomes an adult, there’s another unconscious belief that we start to carry that we can handle things on our own because we’re now big people.

Sam Demma
And it’s like, it’s okay to reach out for support and ask for help. And I just hope that if there’s an educator listening to this right now who’s struggling, that this little portion of this conversation encourages them to reach out and ask for it.

Sam Demma
So I appreciate you sharing that.

Janis Volker
Yes, thank you.

Sam Demma
If there is an educator listening to this or even a student and they are a little overwhelmed, what words of advice or encouragement would you offer them?

Janis Volker
I think, you know, it’s kind of, everyone says this, but chunking it out like one piece at a time, one day at a time. Let’s just focus on today. You know, what can you do today to relieve that stress? You know, can I can you get some help talking to the teacher that you need some help with that you don’t understand the assignment?

Janis Volker
Is there is there another student I can get, you know, to help you? Maybe we do need to call your mom right now and have this conversation and get this off your chest or sit down with a friend. I think just whatever you can do in this moment and not worry about fixing everything between now and three months from now. Let’s just get through today.

Sam Demma
Yeah, that’s a great way to look at it. If there is an educator listening to this and they just want to ask you a question or reach out, what would be the best way for them to get in touch or connect with you?

Janis Volker
Oh, I would say, you know, my school email, right? My school phone, hopefully those are all published on our website and that’d be great.

Sam Demma
Awesome. Jan, just keep taking photos.

Janis Volker
I Will. And you know, I wanted to tell you, I did just read your book and I think it’s fantastic. And one part that really stuck out for me was when you talked about for students, the five people that you surround yourself with. I was like, wow, that I really like how, because that is so true. We’re not saying you’re all going to make bad choices, but if the group you’re with is not doing things like you said to build you up, then they’re not, they’re not helping you get to your goal. So I appreciate you for sharing those types of tips because even though I’ve been in this business 21 years, I can always still learn and find new ways to help students.

Sam Demma
Well thank you for reading the book. You can’t get it at the thrift store for 50 cents unless someone drops it off there, so please don’t. I appreciate you taking the time to be here. I appreciate you reading the book. And I appreciate all the effort and energy you place into helping people, whether it’s teachers or students.

Sam Demma
You are making a serious difference. And I look forward to meeting you here soon.

Janis Volker
Yes, thank you. Two months, we get to see you in person here.

Sam Demma
I’m counting it down. All right, Janis, keep up the great work. And we’ll talk soon. And we’ll talk soon.

Janis Volker
Thanks, Sam.

Join the Educator Network & Connect with Janis Volker

March 20, 2025 by Sam Demma Education Educator Student Leadership Student Success 0

Lynne Beck – Principal at Diamond Jenness Secondary School

About Lynne Beck

Lynne Beck fell in love with the North, its people, and the unique lifestyle it offers when she first arrived in the Northwest Territories in 1992. She initially came to the western NWT to offer short-term swimming and canoeing programs in the Tlicho & South Slave regions. After completing her Bachelor of Education at the University of Prince Edward Island, she was drawn back to the North in the spring of 1993, where she returned to Fort Resolution to establish a long-term swimming and canoeing program and stayed on as an Adult Education teacher.

Her journey in education continued when she moved to Hay River in 1994 to work with Aurora College in Adult Education. In 1998, Lynne joined Diamond Jenness Secondary School (DJSS), where she has held various roles, including Junior and Senior High Teacher, Program Support Teacher, Vice Principal, Guidance Counsellor, Academic Advisor, and ultimately Principal since 2014.

Lynne’s dedication to nurturing the next generation is deeply influenced by her mentor, Ainsley Rose, who emphasized that everything educators do should focus on maximizing student learning and that hope means “helping other people excel.” As a mother who raised her children in Hay River, Lynne sees her legacy not only in her professional roles but in the way she has shaped and influenced her family and the students that she and her dedicated staff have the honour of educating.

Lynne’s love for the North continues to shape her work, as she is committed to making a difference in the lives of students and the community she calls home.

Connect with Lynne Beck: Email | Instagram | Linkedin | Twitter

Listen Now

Listen to the episode now on Apple Podcasts, S potify, or on your favourite podcast platform.

Resources Mentioned

University of Prince Edward Island

Aurora College

Diamond Jenness Secondary School

The Transcript

**Please note that all of our transcriptions come from rev.com and are 80% accurate. We’re grateful for the robots that make this possible and realize that it’s not a perfect process.

Sam Demma
Welcome back to another episode of the High Performing Educator Podcast. This is your host, Sam. And today we are joined by someone I met six months ago, seven months ago over a Zoom call that was supposed to be 30 minutes and lasted an hour for our joint passion for education and young people and making a difference. Today’s guest is my new friend, Lynn Beck, the principal of Diamond Genesse Secondary School. Lynn, thank you so much for taking the time to be here today.

Lynne Beck
Well, thanks for having me.

Sam Demma
Do me a favor, take a moment to introduce yourself and share who you are and what got you into education. Oh, okay.

Lynne Beck
Well, this is, I actually started in recreation. I did waterfront programming back in, I don’t know, let me date myself here, I guess that would have been starting in around 1992, I guess, if I do my northern journey. Prior to that, I heard about the Canadian North. It had always been, with my water, my love of the ocean, always had been a dream of mine to be able to swim in the Atlantic, the Pacific, as well as the Arctic Ocean. I am very happy to say that I made that happen as coming up to the territories. What got me into education? I think partly by chance, definitely, and I’m very much, I did a sort of a work checklist, like what would make you happy one time, and it was like an inventory and what came out of it for me was that challenging renewal drives me. Like that’s my key motivator in my life. So when I look back or I reflect on things as I’m entering, this is my, I guess officially I started in 93 in Port Resolution, Moved to Hay River, or the Hatlodichay Territory, in the end of 1994. Started in adult education and then loved it, absolutely loved it, but didn’t want to not experience working with youth in an educational setting and not just a recreation setting. So, yeah, I feel like I’m all over the place. I can’t keep my head on one question for you.

Sam Demma
But your passion for education has kept you working in it over an extended period of time. It sounds like you found it a little bit by chance, a little bit by design. What keeps you working in education though? What’s the why behind your work?

Lynne Beck
The why behind my work, I would have to say, is an opportunity to accomplish something that’s more than simply what I do. To have an influence, it’s not even as much as an influence as it is to help support others to find their voice. I would have to say that I didn’t, I can honestly say I did not have a voice when I was in school. When I went through the school system, did not have a voice. I was certainly not the perfect student. Shout out to all of those poor people who had to educate me back in the day. I’ll not say where. But yeah, I’ve heard it said that from a parent’s perspective, that the most important thing we ever accomplish is not what we do, but what our children are able to do. kids, but for other kids. And sometimes it’s easier to bring those things out in other people’s children than it is your own. And having had a couple of my own, I now understand that. I believe that our circumstances determine where we start, but our philosophy, our support determines where we finish.

Sam Demma
And you’ve had some incredible stories of success come out of Diamond, the school community. When you think of some of the stories of student success, without sharing a name, is there any that come to mind, you can even change their name if it’s a story that’s a little personal, but I ask because a lot of people listening to this are in education because they want to support and serve and amplify young people. I think it may just remind someone why they got into that work in the first place if they hear about some of the impact. Yeah, it’s tough. Even

Lynne Beck
changing names is tough. So when I think about that… From a high level without a specific story. Yeah, from a high level. Okay, so I think one of the things that kept us speaking a little bit longer than our anticipated, you know, 20 minutes, half an hour, was probably a statement something like this. From 2022 to early 24, our community was evacuated full, slate, full on, community evacuation three times within a 15-month period. And despite that, we had students complete their high school requirements for graduation, in addition to being able to be accepted into Southern institutions and in a small Northern community. When students are accepted into Southern institutions with scholarships and into some amazing programs as well as are also able to go into trades opportunities and when our community, when communities get destroyed, you realize how important trades people are. They literally, without them, we wouldn’t have our homes, we wouldn’t have the infrastructure and the things that keep us warm on days like today where it’s minus 45 with the windchill and vehicles are, you know, vehicles and plumbing and all of those kinds of things still need to operate. So, guide me back to the question.

Sam Demma
When you think of some success stories as a result of education, are there any that come to mind that may inspire a listener who is really getting into this work because they want to help people. I think the fact that there was a collective graduation at the school is exceptional. I’m curious to know, like what do you think contributed to that success despite the setbacks? The team, being acknowledged,

Lynne Beck
students having an opportunity regardless of the cards that they have been dealt, whether it be as a collective, as a community, or even personally, having an opportunity or having someone notice that they have gifts, they have value, helping them find their voice. And watching that, being able to watch someone. We’re an eight to 12 school, so being able to watch, you know, that very young, often timid, a little bit scary, it’s the high school, like everyone’s afraid of high school, right? Trying to get substitute teachers to come in the building. It’s watching that progression from being that shy, timid, doesn’t know, afraid to walk across what we call our concourse and am I wearing the right clothes? Am I doing the right thing? Are people, am I going to be accepted? And then later on and as they progress, am I going to be accepted for who I am? And then before they graduate, am I going to be accepted for what I become and where I go and come back. Like it’s being part of what many people, I believe, that are in education have had the experience of having someone notice them or notice the good in them, because we’re really good at being self-critical, even at a very young age. How do you acknowledge somebody as an educator?

Sam Demma
How do you acknowledge a student in a way that affirms them? And everyone is different, so maybe it’s not a one solution fits all answer, but have you seen it done that you think other educators may be able to replicate? You notice everything and you accept everything, especially the mistakes.

Lynne Beck
We have got to in education, and that’s one thing as a team I feel we do a really good job here. You have got to move beyond the, you know, the teacher is all-knowing, the teacher is perfect, our systems are perfect. We are a human system built for human beings, and human systems and human beings have to make mistakes. We are programmed to make mistakes. Just like, or I guess equally important to that is we’re programmed to learn from our mistakes. And if we don’t learn from our mistakes, we will repeat those mistakes. And so being someone to help stop that cycle of mistake-making and open up to the possibilities that there might be a different way of doing things that works better. I mean, there’s some common speeches that some of my kids, generationally now, have had to listen to, and it’s, you know, is that working for you? Did that work? What about trying this next time? Restorative practices, actually, are the one thing for myself because in all honesty when I started in administration back in 2008 Hey, I wasn’t necessarily wanting to do that Like who really wants to be the VP of any high school? Did you know you’re the one in charge of discipline? Not like it’s a rodeo that I I didn’t have Really a whole lot of desire to do my kids were you know, baby kids back then. But anyway, that was the position I took. That was the challenge that I decided to take on at that time. And in that first year, that was probably one of the lowest points in my career. And not because of who I worked with or the kids I worked with or where I was, But it was the role that had been established that had been done that way for years. And at the end of the year, the thing that stood out for me and that I knew I had to change, that was 2007-8 actually. So it ended in the spring of 2008. I reflected and said, if I can’t do things differently, I want to I’m not doing this again. So, and the reason for that is that the thing I will never forget is a staff that I own because I did it, so I’m not gonna blame anyone else, but I had 417 and a half suspension days signed by me. So, 417 days and I was only one of two VPs at the time and the principal also did some suspensions as well. So I don’t know the collective. I only gathered those stats on myself and I said, I can’t do it. I won’t do it. We’re supposed to be about educating students, not reminding them why they don’t deserve to be here. That is not helping them find their voice. That is not…

Lynne Beck
I don’t know. There’s a whole… We could do a whole podcast on, actually, we could do months of podcast time on the de-implementation of things within the school system. We spend a lot of time talking about the latest and greatest, and there’s all kinds of books published by all kinds of wonderful companies, and it’s fantastic. But that de-implementation, in my opinion, is just as important as implementing new things. But coming back to the restorative practice piece, which also leads to one of my biggest mistakes, because when I started that process, I worked with a UCAN organization who had done a lot of work with the United Nations. They were located in Ontario. I ended up doing a student exchange and all kinds of things to try to have kids that had been experienced, you know, that type of thinking, instead of getting away from, you did, therefore you’re punished before you’re able to come back. It kind of, we started what we thought was restorative when we really looked at the term restitution is still not allowing the two parties to regain their dignity. Restorative practice allows both parties. You need to have willing participants and you need to have… It takes a lot of time. However, the investment in doing that Doing that allows people to accept the fact that we are programmed to make mistakes and learn from them.

Sam Demma
And it makes it okay. What is the big difference between a restorative practice and just restitution, as you mentioned?

Lynne Beck
Restitution focuses on the person who did the wrong to come up with a plan or a way way by which they do something and that thing doesn’t necessarily have to be with another person. It can be, I’m going to shovel the sidewalks of the school, you know, those kinds of things. It’s not about repairing the relationship and not all relationships are meant to be friends, but to do that in a way that respects both of your rights to be in this building and to be educated, maybe sometimes even in the same class, and not to be friends. Learning to be friends and to not be friends is really, really important. It’s a skill and I believe they’re equally important.

Sam Demma
I remember when I was in grade seven, I dared a friend of mine to do something inappropriate to a classmate of ours. And he did it and didn’t tell the principal that I dared him to do it and it was my idea. So he got suspended. I went home. Fortunately, my parents tried their best to instill some good values in me So I felt this inner turmoil and I sat on my bed started bawling my eyes out My dad gets home from work walks past my bedroom does a double take Is everything okay? I Tell him the truth. He’s like get in the car. We drove back to school sat in my principal’s office. Mr. O’Neill told him the truth and he and he asked me a ton of reflective questions. And then he invited the young lady, Michaela, into the office to have a conversation with both of us. And he actually ended up giving me an in-school suspension and keeping it off of my official record. And I’ll never forget that moment. And if I think back at that experience, and I think if my dad had an adverse reaction, if the principal had an extremely adverse reaction, I may have never learned the full lesson, but I did because of the way they handled it, because of the way they approached it. And it sounds very similar to what you just explained. So I didn’t really know too much about restorative practice, but Mr. O’Neill did use it with me.

Lynne Beck
That is, it’s fantastic because again you encourage kids to be human, to make mistakes. But, and it’s not about making the mistake, it’s about what you do with it when you make it. Do you own it? Are you going to learn from it? Are you going to move forward from it? If you’ve harmed someone, getting rid of that, that gross feeling in your gut when you know, like, it just doesn’t feel good doing something because even when we make mistakes and we’re the person in the wrong we need to restore our dignity and our our sense of Being in good balance being okay with ourselves. You don’t want to drag that behind you right you want to let that go and and Next time think before you dare your friend to do whatever it is. You did right like it’s um yeah I mean it it’s it’s beyond that message of you didn’t follow the rules you you don’t deserve to be here you are not good enough get out someone else is going to go fix you and then you come back to us I’m I’m I’m not going to at all diminish but I certainly can’t even begin to express the significant impact of the residential school system, of schools not only in Canada but certainly in the Northwest Territories. Their legacy is very much alive and there are many people who are still suffering the residual effects from that. And that you are not good enough message is something that I personally believe we still struggle, everyone struggles with that, but I think that that’s something because of the deliberateness of that system to essentially annihilate a culture, multi, many, many cultures, because Indigenous culture is vast and it’s very… Each one has its uniquenesses and deserves to be acknowledged individually. In the land that we sit on, it’s the Dene people, but even within that, there are many different groups of people here, where Dene FTA, Chippewyan, Cree, like we have a lot of different groups all within our community.

Sam Demma
I told you on our last conversation about some of my experiences in Kenya and how leading with this lens of curiosity rather than difference or judgment with a group of people I haven’t been exposed to in the past or met and had conversations with led to some beautiful experiences. And I am so excited to be visiting the school in May with an open mind, open heart and lots to learn. And I just want to let you know, I’m so excited about that. And it’s a privilege and I look forward to meeting you and everyone in the community. When you think about people in education who had a big impact on you, it sounds like your school journey was challenging in some regards, but are there any people in your life growing up or even after school that have had a massive impact? And if so, what did they do for you that shifted that belief about being good enough or just your own self-esteem.

Lynne Beck
I mean, there were many. And actually, it’s funny because it’s hard not to reflect and not think of those that certainly helped and those that didn’t. So I think A, being acknowledged. Being acknowledged as a human, not being ignored. Having someone, I guess, want to or make you feel as though they want you to to be there and go above and beyond to say to it to say hello good morning what are you thinking to do and later on or how was that class or it’s it’s it’s little things sometimes or hey you didn’t seem quite like yourself the other day you all right you know I just those little acknowledgments that can just make such a difference. And then collectively, there’s a lot of talk about teacher collective efficacy and that whole notion that I may not be, because I certainly am not the person that everyone can relate to or that I am able to meet the needs of or find whatever that thing is that we need to help someone move further along the line to meet their goals. But when we do it as a collective, someone is able to do that. Maybe it’s little pieces that come together that’s able to do that. Because some kids will take a little bit more than others to believe it, and that’s based on the cards that they’ve been dealt. And if we can help them, even sometimes when those cards are really tough cards to hold, if we can help them play those cards in the best possible way and have them believe that moving forward, they’re gonna be okay and that they are good enough, it’s incredible what can happen.

Lynne Beck
And we’ve seen. I remember moments in my life where

Sam Demma
believing in myself was the last thing I believed in and somebody else’s belief in me made all the difference. And I think that educators’ most important contribution, or any staff member in a school building, is not, the curriculum’s important, but it’s giving a child belief in themselves that they carry forward with them for the rest of their lives. I think that is by far the most important thing we can do. And not even just in schools, but in life in general. And my grandfather always used to say, leave things better than you found it. And if you did that, you lived a beautiful life. And I think it’s the same with people. And I got goosebumps while you were talking and sharing. And I appreciate you spending some time just talking a little bit about your educational journey and restorative practice and some of your beliefs around connecting with students and the importance of acknowledging them. And letting them know that it’s okay to make a mistake because we’re all human and not that it’s necessary Yeah Necessary yeah, right no no kid. You know watch what I don’t know we all we all get so afraid of mistakes

Lynne Beck
Yeah, but the reality is every little kid Watch them learn to walk watch them learn to talk watch them learn to do anything And then all of a sudden we get to that certain age. I don’t know what age it is and then all of a sudden So if you hide it and you pretend you didn’t do it or you try to whatever you’re just gonna do it over and over again until you accept that There’s a different or a better way and then you then if that and if you don’t get that Then unfortunately many people that that start start living with that shame and that guilt and all of those reasons why they turn to other things, sometimes it’s substances, there’s all kinds of things that people turn to, to mask that not being good enough, not being enough, being shameful, like all of those feelings that stand in the way of them developing their gift. We all have a gift. That’s one thing that I love, absolutely fell in love with in the North, is that Indigenous belief that everyone is inherently born with a gift. And it’s the duty of everyone that surrounds that child, because every child is a gift. But to surround that child, to allow those gifts to come through, right? And it’s, no one gift is more important than another. It’s a beautiful way of life. It also gives lots of hope and optimism

Lynne Beck
when you think about your own existence

Sam Demma
from that perspective. And if you’re not using it yet, you know it’s there and you’re still in that search to discover it. And I appreciate you sharing that. Do you have any parting words for an educator who may be listening to this a little bit burnt out, a little bit discouraged? Maybe there’s some challenges in their school building right now and they’re like, ah, what do I do then?

Lynne Beck
Oh, well, number one, I’ll be totally honest. Yesterday, driving back with a colleague, this was not me. We all, like challenge, we’re all being really, really challenged right now in education.
And whether we talk about cutbacks, or we talk about the things that are happening globally or you know there are there are so many reasons to kind of allow yourself to go down into that we call it a rabbit hole up here right where you get sucked into that negativity and I again by far far far from perfect as I have made so many mistakes it’s not even funny, but I’m doing my best not to repeat them. And so when I find myself going down into that rabbit hole, I remind myself, okay, you find what you look for. So if I’m telling myself I’m going to come back today and I’m going to find that negative thing or that negative person or that whatever, I’ll find it. But it’s looking for those little sunflower moments. And even sometimes, even within the people or the situations that are challenging you the most. And that’s really hard to do when it’s 45 below and really dark and da-da-da. when you really, really, really suck, just finding that outlet, whether it is a person, whether it is your dog.

Lynne Beck
My great Dane hears a lot of my problems. She doesn’t try to give me the solution. She just listens, and I do believe that we all have those answers within ourselves. We just have to get it out. I don’t know if that means getting it.

Sam Demma
Maybe that’s why we have unconditional love for our dogs, because they don’t chime in when we don’t want to hear anything.

Lynne Beck
And they don’t judge you, nothing. They keep really good people.

Sam Demma
That’s awesome. Lynn, this is such a lovely conversation. If someone wants to reach out and ask you a question, what would be the best way for them to get in touch with you?

Lynne Beck
Probably email or phone call, because I am like, social media and I are just not, I’m just not, I don’t know, is it because I’m in my 50s? Is it because I see some challenges with social media You know up here. We talk about how kids have to Especially our indigenous students have to walk in two worlds well now with the with this whole social media Fake world where where again that that reinforcement of I’m not good enough. I just I just have a hard time Diving into that and and yeah, I don’t know I mean I get that AI is coming and I get that we need to embrace it and I get that That AI has the potential for for everyone to find their voice regardless of their level of education and it’s something that we need to To to to face head-on and to help students learn, but yeah, but in terms of reaching out best way Social social media no, but phone call or email, yes.

Sam Demma
I think that social media has attempted to make us more connected, but the result has been that we’re less connected and more glued to our phones. Email and phone call is my preferred way of communication too, so you don’t have to explain yourself at all. I will make sure that we just put your email in the show notes in case someone wants to reach out and ask a question. And until I see you in May, thank you so much, keep up the great work, and I’ll talk to you soon.

Join the Educator Network & Connect with Lynne Beck

March 13, 2025 by Sam Demma Education Mental Health Principals Student Success 0

Russ Sommerfeldt – Principal at the Magrath Junior/Senior High School

About Russ Sommerfeldt

Russ Sommerfeldt is a dedicated educational leader with over a decade of experience in K-12 education. He is currently the principal of Magrath Junior/Senior High School, a role he has held for 3.5 years, where he oversees a student population of 430 students from grades 7-12. Russ has a strong background in educational leadership, having previously served as Vice Principal and Athletic Director at the same school.

In addition to his administrative roles, Russ has been actively involved in athletics. He served as the assistant coach for the Senior Varsity Zeniths basketball team, helping lead them to back-to-back zone championships in 2017 and 2018. His dedication to coaching and mentoring students instilled teamwork, discipline, and resilience in the athletes he worked with.

Throughout his career, Russ has demonstrated a passion for teaching and integrating technology into classrooms. He holds a Master of Education degree from Walden University, where he focused on the effective integration of technology in K-12 education. He also earned a Bachelor of Education/Bachelor of Management from the University of Lethbridge.

Russ has taught a variety of subjects, including social studies, science, and robotics. His interest in emerging technologies and their potential to enhance learning drives his approach to education. As a principal, Russ is committed to fostering a positive learning environment, supporting student success, and helping his staff grow as educators. He is also a devoted family man, finding joy in outdoor adventures with his wife and five children.

Connect with Russ Sommerfeldt: Email

Listen Now

Listen to the episode now on Apple Podcasts, S potify, or on your favourite podcast platform.

Resources Mentioned

Magrath Junior/Senior High School

Walden University

University of Lethbridge

The Transcript

**Please note that all of our transcriptions come from rev.com and are 80% accurate. We’re grateful for the robots that make this possible and realize that it’s not a perfect process.

Sam Demma
Welcome back to another episode of the High Performing Educator Podcast. This is your host, Sam Demma, and today we are joined by Russ Sommerfeld. Russ is the principal of McGrath High School. We met a few months ago. I was telling him about a marathon that I was going to be running in October, and we have since ran the marathon.

Sam Demma
I’m still alive. The legs are still moving. He gave me some great advice because he’s run a few of them with his brother, from what I remember from our previous conversation. He’s passionate about education, passionate about athletics.

Sam Demma
Russ, thank you so much for taking the time to come on the show here today.

Russ Sommerfeldt
Hey Sam, I really appreciate it, it’s an honor.

Sam Demma
Tell us a little bit about how you got involved in education.

Russ Sommerfeldt
Yeah, so I actually, my father was an educator, so I followed in his footsteps. He started out as just an ordinary classroom teacher. He went on to become a guidance counselor. And then from there, worked his way into administration as a vice principal, and then eventually

Russ Sommerfeldt
as he ended his career as a superintendent. And so I’ve always looked up to my father. He’s been a role model in my life and he definitely inspired me to go into this field of work and showed me how rewarding it can be to help kids and to help them succeed.

Russ Sommerfeldt
And one of the greatest things he ever taught me was the greatest gift that you can give a kid is confidence and building their confidence. And so I’ve tried to keep that as a motto and remember that throughout my career thus far. Because I think it is key, the world in so many ways tries to pull people down and diminish who they are and what they can do. And we play an important role as educators to help kids believe in themselves and inspire them to think that, you know what, despite all that noise out there in the world, they really can do great things.

Sam Demma
My teacher, Mr. Loudfoot, gave me belief in myself and I still think it’s one of the greatest gifts he ever gave me as a student in this classroom. Now I also was given that gift from my parents, but I more so expected my parents to give it to me and when the teacher was just as certain that I should believe in myself as my own parents were it just, it took my belief in myself to a whole another level because I expected it from them,

Sam Demma
but didn’t really expect it from him. So I couldn’t agree more as a young person who’s closely removed from school and can still reflect on that experience pretty clearly. I think you’re so right. Did your dad also run marathons or are you and your brother the two athletic beasts in the family?

Russ Sommerfeldt
Yeah, you know, my dad isn’t necessarily a runner. My brother was the one that got into it and then he inspired me. It was actually just coming off of COVID, tail end of COVID. I happen to be visiting him. He lives down in Arizona and he said, you know what, I’m running this marathon, why don’t you start training? You got time, we’ve got six months till this thing happens. And so he says, there’s this app you can download and we can communicate, you know, you’re in Alberta, Canada, I’m in Phoenix, Arizona, and we can train together. And so I thought, oh, that does not sound like fun at all. But there was something about that conversation that day that kept coming back to me.

Russ Sommerfeldt
And so I did, I said, let’s do it. And the rest is history, I guess, in terms of me becoming a runner. Because I was not a distance runner in school growing up. Track and field, I would do the 100 meter and nothing longer. So I didn’t ever see myself as a distance runner, but now I would say that I am, and I really enjoy it.

Russ Sommerfeldt
Especially with a leadership position at the school, and I think all leaders could say the same thing. There’s a lot of things that happen in a day. There’s a lot of stresses and a lot of things on your mind and it’s a great outlet to let go of some of those things and to really take care of yourself for your own wellness.

Sam Demma
When you think about your journey through education, sounds like you were inspired by your dad and loved the idea of making a positive contribution in the lives of young kids. What was your first role? And take us through that journey that brought you to McGrath today.

Russ Sommerfeldt
Yeah, so it’s funny enough, but when I went through university, my last teaching internship before I became a full-fledged teacher was actually at McGrath High School. Oh, no way.

Russ Sommerfeldt
I just had an awesome experience. I loved the school so much. And so basically, after I graduated, they didn’t have a position right at that very moment, but I went and taught at the high school I attended when I was in high school for a semester, and I enjoyed every minute of that, but the teacher that I was filling in for was coming back. And then later on, six months later, four months later, they had an opening at McGrath and I was like, you gotta be kidding me, this is awesome. Like I can go back to the place that I love. And so I started out teaching social studies, science, and I started out as a classroom teacher here. Loved every minute of it. Got involved with athletics through coaching, predominantly coached some basketball. Started off at the grade eight level in junior high. Just tried to figure out where can I help out because a school does not run without a lot of volunteer hours from teachers and community members. And so I got to know a lot of people through that process. It’s also interesting how you get to know kids outside of the classroom too.

Russ Sommerfeldt
When you go on maybe a trip with them or at a practice, that influence that you can have have goes much deeper when you see them, and when they see you in a different light as well, not just someone talking at the front of a classroom or trying to teach them something, but the relationship that’s forged is way deeper when you can work with them in a few different ways. And so yeah, I mean, I fell in love with McGrath and then eventually some things opened up in terms of people retire and so on and so forth. And there was other opportunities that presented themselves as well at the school.

Sam Demma
When you think about folks who have helped you in your professional development as an educator, I mean, it does again sound like your dad played a really big role, but is there anyone else that’s top of mind that you think this person really changed the way I thought about certain things?

Russ Sommerfeldt
Yeah, there’s lots of people. And I feel like we live in a great… I feel like I live in a great area of Alberta where there’s a lot of really good educators. And so just the people that I would brush shoulders with in my…we used to call them a professional learning community. And we would meet every quarter or so, and just rubbing elbows with those teachers who were veteran teachers that would show me, hey, have you ever tried this? Or what about this? And those people really shaped the way I thought. On a professional level, like some of the books that I’ve read, I would say Todd Whitaker, his work is incredible, What Great Teachers Do Differently. His work really resonates with me a lot. And he actually came to our school division to start the year off this year, so we heard him speak to us in person, which was great. So I think his work’s been instrumental in kind of my thought process and some of the things that I’ve implemented in my own practices. Throughout my master’s I read a few books by a guy named Will Richardson who he was he’s a very innovative thinker. He talks a lot about how the traditional model of school is broken and how we need to change it and so that having that in my mind has has made me take some risks and try new things and try to figure out how we can better prepare these kids for the future because essentially the school system has been the same since the industrial era, right? It’s almost like the factory model of we’re mass producing kids, you know, and it doesn’t necessarily work.

Russ Sommerfeldt
And so we have to be creative in our thinking and in the way we do things in education now.

Sam Demma
When you think of students within the schools you’ve served, is there any that come to mind that were really struggling and over a period of time made some significant improvements in their own self-confidence? And if it’s a serious story, you could definitely change their name. The reason I bring it up is because a lot of educators don’t get physically thanked by the students themselves because maybe they don’t have the confidence to even walk up to the teacher and tell them how big of a difference they’ve made in their confidence, or they realize it 10 years after they graduate and have no way of getting back in touch with that individual. And so there’s an educator definitely listening to this right now who may be doubting the impact they’re creating and hearing about a story of how education or a teacher or even yourself had impacted a student might remind them what’s possible.

Russ Sommerfeldt
Yeah, and I probably don’t have any monumental stories right off the top of my head, but I’m reminded of one even this year. I had a student come into my office, has since graduated, and this particular student didn’t really like to attend school all that much. Attitude-wise, they were kind of, eh, I don’t know if school is important. But when they came back to my office this year, at the start of the school year, as a 23 or 24-year-old person that’s in university, they had a huge smile on their face, a whole bunch of energy around what they were doing. And they were currently in university, and they thanked me. And I was like, well, I don’t remember doing anything out of the ordinary other than being here every day. But I think the impact that we have on kids is way more than we know.

Russ Sommerfeldt
Even if it’s nothing specific that we did, it’s just believing in them each and every day and never giving up on them. And so, yeah, that comes to mind as one. But there’s a lot of kids out there, too, that, you know, some, they don’t have the support at home necessarily. And so they come, they walk through the doors here at school and the adults here are really the only champion that they have or so that they feel. And I’m sure that their parents are rooting for them as much as they can, but whatever, for whatever reason, the relationship isn’t quite what they would like it to be. And so we play a huge role that way too, just to, you know, listen to kids, be there for them and keep cheerleading.

Sam Demma
I think it’s so important too. There’s some situations where kids are coming to school looking specifically for learning and connections with other kids. And there’s other kids who are coming to school looking for a safe space and looking for food to eat and looking for a totally different set of needs than what other young people might be looking for. And it’s important to recognize that every kid is carrying a different backpack, that they all have different, they all have those different challenges.

Sam Demma
I think that education is one of the most important ways to shape the future, and you’re doing amazing work, and everyone at McGrath is as well, but it comes with its own set of challenges also. What do you think some of the challenges are in education these days?

Sam Demma
Well, I think I’ve noticed that student engagement is a really tough thing.

Russ Sommerfeldt
You know, kids, when they go home, they can learn what they want to learn instantaneously on YouTube or on TikTok. And it is so engaging that when they come to school and maybe the method or the model of that learning is different, it’s hard for them to really engage with what it is. And so I think just helping kids understand the value of what they’re learning and trying to make it applicable to their real life, because honestly, as a part, like with the work that Will Richardson did that I referenced a little bit earlier, a lot of people just learn on demand now. It’s not that they feel like they have to read a whole textbook to learn. No, they can, you can get specific and really good information on specific things that you’re interested in. So I think just helping kids see the importance of what we do here every day. And even when it’s not so engaging or interesting, I think the bigger lesson is learning how to stick to something, even when it’s really hard. Similar to what probably you learned and what I learned through this process of training for a marathon. There’s days when you think, man, this is tough, this is hard, why am I doing this?

Russ Sommerfeldt
And as you stick to that process, the end result is beautiful. And I think a lot of times kids won’t see that until after they’re gone. And that’s why we don’t always see the impact that we have as educators.

Sam Demma
And there’s also opportunities. Like there’s definitely challenges and I think being aware of them is important so we can think about ways to shift certain things, which it sounds like you are, which is amazing. What do you think some of the opportunities are each day in the school system right now? Oh, there’s so many.

Russ Sommerfeldt
I think that a school is kind of a mini society, so to speak, or a mini community. And so, you know, we have a really excellent extracurricular program, athletics program, and on any given night almost at our school, because we’re a seven through 12, we have 10 athletic teams that are playing, whether they’re playing here or elsewhere. But here in the school specifically, there’s a lot of opportunities for kids to get involved and to learn real life skills. So some of them, I know we have an entrepreneur class where kids are making yogurt, frozen yogurt for the game.

Russ Sommerfeldt
And then we sell them at the game to help support these programs that we offer. So they’re actually learning that skill. They could also come work in the concession where they’re taking people’s orders, communicating with them that way, giving that information to the people in prep and getting food out the door so that people can watch the game. We also try to make it a kind of a big production.

Russ Sommerfeldt
So I got kids that are working with our streaming and they’re learning the tech side of things. They’re learning how to do instant replays of a whole broadcast thing and that type of thing. from the behind the scenes stuff of people getting, you know, when we run a tournament, they’re building these, we call them either swag bags or a little care package for each of the players that come. So it’s pretty cool to see all the goings-ons in the building, and that’s just one example. Like, we have the same thing with drama and band and fine arts, where kids can get involved and do a lot of good that’s not academic necessarily, but as a hidden curriculum, it’s very valuable.

Sam Demma
When you think of your community, your mini society of this school, is there anything that you think is very unique or that your school does that may be very unique from other schools? And maybe you don’t even think it’s unique, but for a school in a different province, it could totally be something they’ve never tried or done before.

Sam Demma
Does anything come to mind that you think would be worth sharing?

Russ Sommerfeldt
Yeah, you bet. So we’re unique in the sense that we have kindergarten through grade 12 basically under the same roof. Wow. The elementary school, so K to six, is in its own part of the building.

Russ Sommerfeldt
It has its own administration, it’s its own school, so it’s run separately. And then over in my end, we have seven through 12. But from the moment these kids enter kindergarten, because of the proximity and because we’re such a small community and people know each other so well, they feel a part of the high school. They feel a part of this mini society right from the get go. Specifically with the extracurricular activities because the kindergarten kids, the grade one kids, they get read to by the senior varsity basketball players on occasion. They’re invited to our pep rallies. So they learn the cheers, they’re wearing their blue and gold, they’re decked out. We’ve even had alumni make trading cards of the kids and these little kids will be getting autographs of these players after the game. So it’s unique in a sense that high school sports is much bigger in a really small town than maybe even some of the larger centers because everybody in the whole community is behind it. And it’s really cool. At any one of our games, there may be a thousand people at these games.

Russ Sommerfeldt
And I’ve been to other high schools across the province and even in other provinces, and the crowds just aren’t that big. You’ll get the parents and maybe some family members, but people that aren’t even related to a single player on the court, they’re here because it’s the main event. There’s nothing else going on in the town, so they come, they support. And so in that sense, I think we’re unique, that the school community is basically the hub of the entire town.

Russ Sommerfeldt
And we do a lot of things here at school that spill over into other aspects of the community, which is really cool.

Sam Demma
More rural schools, more rural schools. That’s cool. I love that. Did you grow up in the same area as the school? Or are you from elsewhere?

Russ Sommerfeldt
Yeah, so I grew up in Carsten, which is about 30 minutes southwest of here, very similar culture, where small town and community involvement’s key. And so, yeah, it feels like home, even though it’s half hour away, right? So it’s very similar.

Sam Demma
A lot of other schools struggle to engage their parent communities. It sounds like the parents of these kids show up for things. Aside from the fact that there may be nothing else going on, do you think there’s other things that contribute to people in the community getting really involved in their kids’ school activities?

Russ Sommerfeldt
You know, I think a big part of it is building that relationship with parents and just asking them. I think we forget sometimes that people are willing if they are clear on what it is that is needed. And so figuring out a system and just turning it over sometimes to the parents. And you got to be a little bit careful, but with some planning and with some preparation, they can do a lot better job than I ever could. So I’m the type of leader who wants to engage and bring in as many other people as possible because me, myself could do it one way, but there’s a lot of other people that have lots of great ideas, probably much better than mine. And so I like to bring all those ideas to the table to make it the best possible experience for kids.

Sam Demma
And we only have two hands too, right? So every person brings two more and a brain. So you put it all together, you can move mountains and do some cool stuff. This has been a lovely conversation, the time’s flown by. I just wanna say thank you so much for investing the time into the show to talk a little bit about your educational journey and some of your beliefs around education. If there’s an educator listening to this and wants to reach out to you or get your training plan for running their first marathon, what would be the best way for them to get in touch?

Russ Sommerfeldt
Yeah, definitely send me an email. Russ.Sommerfeld at westwind.ab.ca. I’m sure you can link that into the notes. I won’t give my cell phone number out over a podcast, but my email for sure, or our school website, mcgrathhigh.ca, and they can find me there as well. Happy to talk to anybody who’s interested.

Sam Demma
Awesome, Russ, thank you so much for taking the time. Keep running, keep up the great work, and we’ll talk to you soon. and we’ll talk to you soon. Hey, thanks a bunch.

Join the Educator Network & Connect with Russ Sommerfeldt

March 6, 2025 by Sam Demma Athletic Director Education Principals School Administration Student Leadership Student Success 0

Sean Kenney – Director for the Nova Scotia International Student Program in the Tri-County Regional Centre for Education

About Sean Kenney

Sean Kenney is the director for the Nova Scotia International Student Program in the Tri-County Regional Centre for Education and the Coordinator for Community Learning, International Services, and Family of School Supervisor. Previous to his current role, he has been a dynamic classroom teacher, vice principal, and principal spanning 30 years in Manitoba, Quebec, and his home province of Nova Scotia. Although desperately missing being in a school each day working with students, he is broadening his impact within his regional of 6200 students.

Sean has always engaged students in thoughtful and meaningful ways while having a sharp focus on equitable practices that are safe and inclusive of everyone in his school community. Each year he welcomes over 250 students from at least 20 different countries into his schools and communities while serving as their custodian and ensuring that they have a rich Nova Scotian experience.

Connect with Sean Kenney: Email | Instagram

Listen Now

Listen to the episode now on Apple Podcasts, S potify, or on your favourite podcast platform.

Resources Mentioned

Nova Scotia International Student Program

Tri-County Regional Centre for Education

The Transcript

**Please note that all of our transcriptions come from rev.com and are 80% accurate. We’re grateful for the robots that make this possible and realize that it’s not a perfect process.

Sam Demma
Welcome back to another episode of the High Performing Educator Podcast. This is your host, Sam Demma. Today we are joined by Sean Kenney, the Director for the Nova Scotia International Student Program in the Tri-County Regional Center for Education and the Coordinator for Community Living of International Services and Family of School Supervisor. But he’s been in education for a long time in Manitoba, in Quebec, in Nova Scotia. He works with international students from all over the world and I’m so grateful to have him on the show here today. Sean, thank you so much for taking the time to be here.

Sean Kenney
Thanks so much, Sam. I appreciate the invitation.

Sam Demma
Where in the world are you tuning in from today?

Sean Kenney
That’s a great question. Most of my work is centered in Southwest Nova Scotia, so my office is in Yarmouth, one of the small towns in the southwest portion of the province. That’s where I am right now. However, some of my work takes me different areas of the world, including different parts of Canada where I first met you at the CAPSI conference in Niagara Falls last spring. Yeah, recently for work purposes I’ve traveled to Thailand and Vietnam for a couple weeks meeting with prospective students, partners, and agencies through our international student program.

Sam Demma
When young people, aspiring educators, think about education, most of the time they think about teaching in the classroom or being a principal of a local school, not traveling the globe recruiting students to come to Canada and to provide them with a home away from home and a life-changing experience. At what point in your own educational journey did you uncover international education, and how did you get involved?

Sean Kenney
That’s a great question. Many moons ago, you alluded to the fact that I’ve been in different provinces. And I began education, oh, 34, 35 years ago now, when I went to teacher’s college. So it’s been some time.

Sean Kenney
And at that time, I was really passionate thinking, okay, I’m going to be the, you know, a great math teacher. And that was my singular focus. And truth be told, I’ve taught a number of other subjects other than math. Over those years, you know, I’ve held different roles as a teacher from grade seven through 12. There’s been math, there’s been science, industrial arts, leadership, outdoor ed, you name it. You kind of try some different things. But then being a teacher and vice principal, I was first acquainted with the International Student Program in that regard at one of my previous schools in Shelburne County, Barrington High. We’d have a number of students come in and that was my first introduction to that. So over the course of the last 15 to 20 years, I’ve had kind of an arm’s length support of the International Student Program. During that time, I’ve got to meet a number of great students from all over the world. And then, as we started to develop programs in schools where we’re able to create a bigger network of host families, we were able to welcome more students.

Sean Kenney
And in doing so, we were able to put in a number of different programs in place to help support those students. It was a few years ago, the opportunity came up where the previous director for the International Student Program in our region took a job change. And I thought, okay, I’ve been a leader from a number of different schools and I’ve always felt for me personally, kind of four to six years is that kind of window where it’s important for the organization and the person to seek new opportunities and change. It’s good for everyone that we continue growth through taking new opportunities. So I said, okay, let me give this a try. And Sam, my eyes were blown wide open because certainly from this lens and the supporting role that I’ve got, I didn’t realize all that was involved in the International Student Program, having been a teacher, vice principal, and principal. Certainly, it’s been very alarming and enlightening to see all that’s involved in welcoming all these students in our program. We’ve actually got one of the most esteemed public school, high school programs in Canada.

Sean Kenney
It’s certainly well respected across the country. We’ve welcomed over 25,000 students across 70 different schools in Nova Scotia. In my particular region, we normally bring 200-250 students. Some will be here for as short as four weeks and some will be here for the full year. Some actually begin in grade 7, 8, 9 and they’ll continue for three or four years to graduate. It’s really exciting, the opportunities. And certainly, as you get to travel and meet different agents and partners, you get to see how my starting role 35 years ago as a math teacher has certainly changed greatly. However, not losing sight of the fact that we’re providing great educational experiences, not just for our Canadian students, but also welcoming students from so many different countries.

Sam Demma
For an educator listening to this, who’s aspiring to get into a school, but has never thought or considered about international education as a way they could provide an exceptional experience for young people and also make a contribution in slightly different ways.

Sam Demma
What are some of those services you provide or things you do on a day-to-day basis to paint a little bit of a picture for the role?

Sean Kenney
Yeah, that’s a great question. So I see my role right now within our region as two, you know, it’s, it’s, there’s many different things on my platter of responsibilities. And one of them is really specific around our 150 international students that are part of our program. a more rural way of life. And then there’s a lot of people coming from other countries and immigrating and moving into our communities. So all of our teachers and staff in all schools

Sean Kenney
have been forced to think of things in a different way, as far as a culturally responsive approach in welcoming all of our students and all of the different cultures in our schools. Previous to COVID, quite honestly, a number of our schools would have had limited experience to people from other countries unless it was through the International Student Program. In our region and across the province, that has traditionally been from grades 7 to 12. So a lot of our elementary schools didn’t have those opportunities. So when we think of those best teaching practices and school practices and creating welcoming schools, they were often limited to junior and senior highs. eyes. So now within our region and across the province, and I would guess across the whole country, this has become a wider focus for every educator.

Sam Demma
When you think about your journey in education and international education, who comes to mind as mentors or folks that have helped you and supported you in your professional and personal development? Yeah, that’s a great question. So, the founder and forefather of the Nova Scotia International Student Program was by the name of Paul Millman, and he’s recently moved on over the last couple of years to take on new ventures. So, certainly I was introduced to him while I was still a vice principal about 12 years ago at a conference in a little town named DeBert. And at that time, they brought together a number of administrators. So watching him and his passion from a distance has certainly been incredible.

Sean Kenney
As I’ve become part of the program, I get to see his far-reaching impact and passion and how he’s instilled that on every single… People are living and breathing the program. I think sometimes we take for granted that, you know, a regular classroom, it ends at three o’clock. Well, the International Student Program, it’s a 24-7, 365-day gig where we’ve got the responsibility for that incredible school experience, but as well, we run our own homestead. So it’s creating a network of quality families that welcome students in for this intercultural exchange that’s so rich.

Sean Kenney
So within our program, I’ve been mentored by a friend and colleague, someone actually oddly enough I knew back at Teachers College 35 years ago, and he and I have had similar kind of lived experiences professionally where, you know, he left Teachers College in the mid-90s, became a teacher, moved, you know, different opportunities. Sometimes opportunities present themselves to you by suggestion. People are thinking, hey, there’s an opportunity here, and I think you might be able to fill this need right now. And I think that’s often how people might step into a leadership role in education, especially when it comes to that of a vice principal. I don’t know that many people go in education thinking, wow, one day I’d love to be a VP or a principal. It kind of happens out of curiosity and just different lived experience where you keep building on different things. So he’s been a wonderful mentor as well as our entire program with this particular journey over the past two and a half years.

Sam Demma
What did those folks do for you that had the greatest impact?

Sean Kenney
I think when you bring varied experiences to a new role and set of responsibilities, it’s around validating some of those curiosities, thinking, okay, is this kind of what’s expected? Am I heading in the right direction. He would provide a number of suggestions to me and he was always there for support when I needed.

Sean Kenney
There’s a lot of text messages and emails, hey, in this situation, it’s new for me but probably not for you. This is what I’m kind of talking through those. Because when you’re dealing with, you know, when you’re dealing with humans, man, there can be some high emotions, big emotions, and you definitely want to make sure you get things right. There’s no playbook that’s black and white. We live in the gray when we’re supporting our kids and families, right?

Sam Demma
I think the unique thing about having a mentor who’s been working in a similar field for such a long period of time, is like you mentioned, it may be new for you, but for them, it could be something they’ve experienced dozens or hundreds of times. And there’s a phenomenal book by a guy named Ray Dalio called Principles, and he talked about a mentor that he had in the book, and he would bring him his challenges, and the mentor would say, oh, it’s just another one of those.

Sam Demma
He categorized a lot of his challenges into buckets of things that his mentor had experienced in the past. And even if they haven’t experienced it based on the breadth of their whole experience, they can probably help make a good suggestion even if they’ve never faced something like that before themselves. You said that international education is 24-7.

Sam Demma
It doesn’t end at three o’clock. I think it takes a pretty special human to dedicate their life to supporting young people From 8 a.m. To 3 p.m. Let alone in a position where it seems like it never stops Did you have any experiences growing up that? Inspired you to want to help kids and work with young people or why did you choose this work? Well, it was the fame and fortune. I was looking for I think it’s a calling. People who want to help and be in a helping field, they find their way there. So for me, I think of a couple of pivotal moments and actually they both happened for me as a student when I moved schools. My family moved schools when I was in grade six. So in Nova Scotia, many of our elementary schools go until grade six. So it was kind of a big deal being the oldest of three boys. We ended up moving to this small rural community and I was like, wow, this is really different. Um, and the teacher there kind of, she saw things in me that I didn’t really see in myself at that time. Right. And then it happened again in grade 10 when I arrived at the high school, first year in a new school and kind of had a similar experience. So I thought, okay, these people, um, are suggesting that I might be a great in school one day. And for me, I found math easier than many of the other subjects.

Sean Kenney
So, between that and enjoying sports, certainly enjoyed sports playing as a child when I realized I was far from a pro ball player, I was never going to be a professional athlete. Later in high school, I can’t remember if it was, must have been the summer of grade 11, a friend, me and one of my friends, we ended up coaching a minor ball team and working with the little league kids at that time would have been five, six, seven. It was fun.

Sean Kenney
And I think that kind of was the hook. It’s one of those things that if you enjoy working with kids, you know, just one of those things. With working with kids, every day there’s something new. So you might get some of those moments, but there’s so many things like, wow, that’s different.

Sean Kenney
So I think always being curious, willing to learn and open to new opportunities, that’s what I love about working with kids. There’s never a dull moment. That’s in transitioning to this role, it’s a little different, right?

Sean Kenney
Having been a principal, I was there every day with 575 students every day. So you get to interact all day long, you know, and this one here, working more regionally based, it’s a little different as far as your impact and influence because you don’t get to see every student every day, which is something I had desperately missed, but I’m adjusting to, right? Finding other ways to kind of get to see them.

Sam Demma
There’s unique opportunities in every field, in every, I believe, in every vocation, every job. I think one of the unique opportunities in the work you’re doing now is you’re creating homes away from a home for lots of kids who these experiences could be life changing and and when you think about the students that you’ve served over the years in international education, is there a story of a student that might come to mind right now who was really nervous and shy and maybe even struggling at the start of their international experience but by the end, we’re emailing you, mister Kenny, you’re not gonna believe this. Yeah. And if there isn’t a specific email, that’s okay too. But if there’s a story, I would love for you to share it because there’s an educator listening to this that’s doubting if they’re making a difference. And I think it’s stories like that that really remind them to keep showing up.

Sean Kenney
Yeah, so having been a principal for a number of years, right? And I’ve had the luxury of working in grade primary to 12 schools. And I always shared with my staff, listen, different grade levels have different levels of gratitude.

Sean Kenney
Some are time delayed. Some are like that email that you’re going to delay send. So in elementary schools, gratitude is daily. You get hugs and kisses and snot on your pants from the hugs, right? So you feel that love every day. In high school, those major milestones, the proms, the graduations, when kids are leaving, you get a lot more gratitude. Middle school, it’s delayed, right? So some, you feel that love, right? And you know that you’re making that difference, but for some, they come back. So from my experiences, I’ve had a number of students that are like, man, I just want to talk to you. I really appreciate that you never gave up on me, even though I didn’t deserve that unconditional positive regard or love that you were given. Because sometimes at that time when I was in grade 7 or 8, I was 13, 14, I wasn’t nice. I wasn’t nice to you. I wasn’t nice to other people around me. I just wasn’t nice to myself. So it’s kind of keeping that in mind. With that said, it’s not lost on me the great responsibility that we have in making sure when our students come as directors, we all serve as the legal custodian. So I take them on as my kids. And one of the great responsibilities that I see is taking care of that homestay part, making sure that we vet the families in an appropriate way so that I’m convinced that if my kids were in another country, my own children, I’ve got two that are 17 and 19, am I comfortable with my kids staying in that home thousands of kilometers away? So we’ve been investing time and energy in making sure that all of our homestay families have a common vision of what it is to take care of our kids while they’re here in Nova Scotia. And unfortunately at times I’ve had to make tough decisions where we’ve had to part ways on that hosting relationship. And that’s really difficult to do because parents are sending their kids to Nova Scotia or Canada hoping for a certain experience and many of them will share. And the great thing is, Sam, I’m Sean now, I’m not Mr. Kenny, which is a great thing.

Sean Kenney
In the international community, I don’t have to be Mr. Kenney. I love it. So they come and they say, Sean, this is just like the Hollywood movies, right? When they think of high school, what’s high school like? Well, North American high school is very different than it is in Turkey or Germany or, you know, pick a country, Japan, South Korea, any of the countries that we host from. So, yeah, it’s that responsibility. And we do a great job making sure we transition the students in. So we have a big team of people, whether it’s our home state coordinators, our program managers, we have school ambassadors, which is a wonderful program. They’re Canadian students in every one of our high schools that are trained to help welcome students as they arrive and help them transition through all of their firsts that happen during their stay.

Sean Kenney
So yeah, there’s a lot of stories where kids come, they’re really scared, sometimes they experience culture shock. I’ve really enjoyed my travels with students when I pick them up from the airport and help kind of relieve their concerns. It’s a three, three and a half hour drive from Halifax Airport down to Yeremeth.

Sean Kenney
So if I’ve got three or four students brand new to Canada, we have nice chats coming back and forth.

Sam Demma
When you think about building relationships and having a positive impact in the life of a young person, have you gotten any advice that you think would be worth sharing with some of the educators that are listening right now that might just be starting to work with youth and wanna make a big difference. Like what advice would you share with them that you’ve received at points in your career that you thought were helpful?

Sean Kenney
There’s a lot of different ones. So one of my mentors as a school-based administrator, he was my principal while I was his vice principal for seven years together. And one of the piece of advice he shared was, no matter what the situation is, when you’re speaking with a child, speak to them as if their parents are sitting in the room with you. Show them the same care and concern you would. You can’t be two different people, and that’s really stuck with me.

Sean Kenney
And some of our CRP work in our region, Shrocky Holly, he talks about VABing, which is the validating, affirming, building, bridging. So, I mean, that’s all, it’s about outrageous love, right? So, that’s kind of the part that keeps us going as educators and relationships are everything.

Sean Kenney
Programs, they come and go. Those are kind of the what’s. The why’s and who’s are kind of that vision of purpose. What is your purpose? And who, who’s it all about? Getting to know those kids, getting to know your staff, getting to know your families and having relationships. Certainly there are some time obstacles and barriers, but that is by far the most important thing. And certainly when I think of some of the work that you share in your presentation, it’s around kind of getting to know those kids so that you can help them raise their ceiling of expectations or goals, dreaming big, think big, and then go for it daily with small, reasonable steps. And that’s certainly what resonated with me in the work that we do. And certainly, Sam, I’m looking forward to bringing you to the East Coast here, hopefully in the next school year, so that we can get you to help bring your message, because certainly I think it would resonate with all of our students.

Sam Demma
I appreciate it, Sean. And I’m so grateful that we were able to share some time on the podcast. I know there’s a lot of educators listening to this who have not even considered or thought about international education as a way they can make a difference and express their own passions for working with young people. I wish you nothing but success in all of your upcoming travels. And if there is someone listening to this that wants to touch base with you, reach out, share some delayed gratitude or ask a question, what would be the best way for them to touch base with you?

Sean Kenney
Yeah, so I’m sure on the bio of this podcast, you’ll share that, but my email is sean.kenney at tcrce.ca. Certainly they can look me up on LinkedIn, Facebook, or even Instagram, certainly, even WhatsApp. So I’m certainly willing and able to help answer any questions or even just chat with anyone who’s kind of curious about this because certainly I didn’t think that my educational journey that started 35 years ago would end up in international education right now. And it’s certainly a very wide field and certainly a niche part of public schools.

Sam Demma
Well, one thing, if you’re listening to this right now and you do want to reach out, just don’t call him Mr. Kenney, refer to him as Sean or else you’ll not get a response.

Sean Kenney
That’s definitely one of the top 20 great things about this new role.

Sam Demma
Sean, thank you so much for taking the time. This is awesome. Keep up the great work.

Sean Kenney
Appreciate it, Sam. Thanks.

Join the Educator Network & Connect with Sean Kenney

February 27, 2025 by Sam Demma Director of Education Education Educator Student Leadership Student Success 0

Shannon Mitchell – Training Specialist, Foster Care at The Family Centre in Edmonton

About Shannon Mitchell

Shannon Mitchell is a dedicated social worker based in Edmonton, Alberta, with a strong focus on learning and development. She began her career 20 years ago in Home Visitation, supporting families as they welcomed new babies. Most recently, she has been serving as a Training Specialist in Foster Care at The Family Centre in Edmonton. Previously, she worked as the Provincial Training Coordinator for the Alberta Home Visitation Network Association, providing training and support to professionals working with families.

Shannon is passionate about applying adult learning principles to design unique and engaging learning experiences. Her background in Home Visitation has shaped her ability to think creatively and view eLearning as an opportunity to engage differently. Whether through reflective book clubs to meet prerequisites, innovative tools, or hands-on practice opportunities, Shannon enjoys crafting trainings that support learners to learn!

Connect with Shannon Mitchell: Email | Linkedin

Listen Now

Listen to the episode now on Apple Podcasts, S potify, or on your favourite podcast platform.

Resources Mentioned

The Family Centre in Edmonton

Alberta Home Visitation Network Association

The Transcript

**Please note that all of our transcriptions come from rev.com and are 80% accurate. We’re grateful for the robots that make this possible and realize that it’s not a perfect process.

Sam Demma
Welcome back to another episode of the High Performing Educator. This is your host, Sam Demma. And today we are joined by Shannon Mitchell, who is a dedicated social worker based in Edmonton, Alberta. She’s very passionate about early childhood education, adult education, learning and development, and also streaming.

Sam Demma
She has an insane tech setup. The first time I met her, she very much impressed me with her, with her technology and skills and I’m so grateful that she’s taking the time out of her schedule to come on the show here today. Shannon, thank you so much for being

Shannon Mitchell
here. Oh, thank you for having me. It’s really exciting. My first podcast, Sam. This is the first one? Yeah. The first of many. Well, let’s hope. We’ll put my LinkedIn and people can can tag me if they want to talk to me more, right? Absolutely.

Sam Demma
Uh tell me more about your passions for both childhood education and also adult education. Where do those come from?

Shannon Mitchell
So they intersect in a way that maybe people don’t always think about very much. I can’t say that I thought about it much when I was kind of in the field, you know, one-on-one doing work with families. But when you look at early childhood, first of all, it’s really the basis for everything. So every dollar we put into early childhood gives us back about $4 into our society. So really important and really fun work. And I did a lot of work with families

Shannon Mitchell
where I was supporting them in the home to, you know, embrace their parenting style, to find things that are working for their family, to really engage them in being mindful and intentional parents and really looking at what they can do to support their child’s development now, what they can do to support their family’s development, those sorts of things. What I wish I had had a better understanding of, although I didn’t do terrible, Sam, I’ll tell you, is how adult learning principles would play into that so well. And how understanding how adults learn could have really helped me support them

Shannon Mitchell
to be learning new skills as they were learning to parents. And so as I continued my career and got into working with teaching training professionals about how to, you know, work with families and things. I found the two passions just really collided in a way that I wasn’t necessarily expecting, but was logical if I kind of took a step back and did some reflection.

Sam Demma
That’s amazing. Did you know growing up that you wanted to work in development of children and adults, or is it something that you stumbled into?

Shannon Mitchell
Kind of. So I was that kid. I was a volunteer. I worked at a food bank from like from the time I volunteered at a food bank for the time I was like 12, until I was about 16. I really was, you know, I was a candy striper. I did those things. I really enjoyed helping people. I really enjoyed getting involved. And I went through a little period kind of in my late teens. I think when our children are 12, 13, 14, we should really nurture that spirit because it’s there in almost all children and they don’t always know how to help. But there’s often this thing that comes out of

Shannon Mitchell
really recognizing the world and wanting to make a difference. And I believe if we really hone in on that, if we really help them grab that and go with it, that things can go really well in the world. I think it could change the whole world if we really help children at that age really move through that. I ran into, when I was about 16, 17, some really significant hypocrisy. And I didn’t have anyone to talk to about it.

Shannon Mitchell
I wish I had the internet. I feel like the internet would have helped me, maybe. But I was trying to process this adult hypocrisy I was running into, and what it did is turn me off. I was going to go work for an oil company. And you know, so things evolved as I went to university and kind of started to find

Shannon Mitchell
myself again. I had a very, very good instructor in university, a very good person to help me pick my classes. So I was always choosing classes that would let me do other things. And in the end, I ended up with a social work degree. I was like, this is actually where I want to be. I do want to support people. I actually do have this love. I just, you know, didn’t know how to process what was happening, you know,

Shannon Mitchell
in a different space that I wasn’t used to. And I wasn’t used to being in an adult space at 16 either and running into those kind of challenges. So it’s definitely been an adventure to get there. Actually, it’s four majors in university, just in case anyone’s out there like trying to find themselves, it’s okay. You’ll figure it out.

Sam Demma
What were the other three?

Shannon Mitchell
So English, and then I was like, what am I going to do an English degree? So I was like, maybe I’ll be an English teacher. So it’s interesting. I actually did look at teaching for a hot second and I didn’t enjoy the class that I took,

Shannon Mitchell
which is a really ridiculous reason to change your entire major again. But I was like, oh, maybe I don’t want to teach. Like maybe this isn’t for me. I don’t, I don’t really, what I thought was I’m not really feeling these students and they would be my peers if I went to work in a school. So I went to social work and I had the

Shannon Mitchell
opportunity to take my social work in this really secluded little corner of Saskatchewan where we had an off-campus. So there was like 20 of us taking it kind of all at the same time. It was in-person instruction at that point because it was a little too early for the internet to be really good at learning, frankly. And had this really great experience. Learned more than I think a lot of people do in their degree because we had such an insular course and were able to kind of learn from each other

Shannon Mitchell
and really dig into courses in a way that I wasn’t expecting.

Sam Demma
That’s amazing. It sounds like you had a unique educational journey and it makes me think about my own. I was someone who went to school not really knowing what I wanted to do with my life and taking a major because I thought it was just the right thing to do because everybody else was doing it

Sam Demma
and then postponing it to pursue other passions and I haven’t returned yet. It’s been a little while. And I think it’s so important that everyone remembers that all paths are different and every journey is different

Sam Demma
and there’s no special timeline that we’re all existing on where we have to do something by a certain age or a certain time, or we are quote unquote behind. Absolutely. I loved what you said about, before we started this call, that everyone as an adult, maybe even as a young person,

Sam Demma
should get a semester of time where they’re just tasked with personal development and exploration. Tell me a little bit about where that thought or idea came from.

Shannon Mitchell
So I’m currently between things. I’m looking for employment and thinking about my next steps. And as part of that process, I’ve been filling my time with things like my library programming and LinkedIn opportunities and Nonprofit Hive, anyone who knows who that is,

Shannon Mitchell
it’s amazing, going to free seminars, downloading trials of software and teaching myself how to do the rest of the adult learning online that I haven’t had the opportunity to in my employment yet. Like, really enjoying myself. If I didn’t have to worry about my next step right now, I’d be in my renaissance, right? And so, yeah, my thought was every five years we should all have this opportunity to like take a semester, four months, and just do personal development and then hop back into employment seamlessly, get paid, not have to worry about that paycheck.

Shannon Mitchell
I think that there’s a lot of… When we’re in that grind and we’re in that work, it’s hard to make time for those things that you always want to get to. And so I’m finding I don’t have enough time still, but I’m kind of doing the things that I wish I would have more time for. And then maybe it will set me up to do more of that when I actually get back to working full-time again.

Sam Demma
There’s a lot of educators listening to this that are burnt out and stressed and anxious and pouring in so much to students and teachers and everyone in their buildings. That thought is probably so juicy for them. Oh my goodness, if I could just get a semester

Sam Demma
to take a break and explore some curiosities, it would probably excite them. For someone who hasn’t explored their curiosities in a long time, they probably wouldn’t even know where to start or like what to do with that space. What are a few of the things you’ve been exploring

Sam Demma
that have surprised you or you’ve become super interested in and can recommend

Shannon Mitchell
somebody else check them out as well. So a couple of things for me if you live anywhere near a bigger city check out your library because I know my library will allow people from the neighboring communities to access it as well and it’s no longer just books I’ve learned to use a sewing machine a laser engraver a whole studio lab space I don’t know what I’m going to do with a studio lab space, but they got one. And so I learned how to use it, you know, all sorts of things that I just wouldn’t imagine.

Shannon Mitchell
And I’m like, well, if they offer it, I’m going to take it. And just they have the equipment, I can go borrow it once I’m certified. So I did that. The other thing is, I wasn’t so sure about exploring the self-directed learning aspect. there’s a lot of learning that happens best through interpersonal communication. But exploring the self-directed learning, the kind of technology side of our field, has actually been really interesting and I can see how the two can support each other so well.

Shannon Mitchell
There’s so many times, and I mean, having been a while since you’ve been a student, Sam, but there’s so many times when you’re kind of learning the same thing over and over again to make sure everyone’s got it, to make sure everyone’s got the same base. It’s basic knowledge. It doesn’t require a lot of synthesis right from us. That stuff on self-directed learning could take care of so much. I can remember like, you and I’ve talked about our generation gap, right? So we’re talking early 90s when I was in high school. And I can remember learning the metric system like six

Shannon Mitchell
times in six different courses through high school. High school is only three years in Saskatchewan. I was like so done with it. But every class had to make sure you had the base. So if I could have just gone on a self-directed learning, bloop, bloop, bloop, bloop, show I knew it, and then we could move on, life would have been so much easier, right?

Shannon Mitchell
So I think about that sometimes, how those two things are gonna work hand in hand. And I didn’t expect to find that. If you’d asked me what I thought about self-directed learning in June of this year, I would have been like, eh, I’m not sure it’s a good idea.

Shannon Mitchell
And now I can definitely see how the two can support one another and make learning more effective. And really, younger people don’t always want this interaction in particular. You know, it’s a little trickier. Those who grew up in the pandemic, even trickier yet, I think. So if we can kind of interacting with the machine kind of way, I think that we can really find something that will support adult learning principles and support people where they want to learn right now.

Sam Demma
When you think about your time doing work in learning and development, what aspects of it bring you the most joy and fulfillment?

Shannon Mitchell
I really like, I see it as a bit of a puzzle. So I am I also like telling stories and I think storytelling is actually amazing. So it’s like a win win. But I think that, you know, when I set out a course and I’m looking at what people are trying to learn, you start breaking it up into half hour chunks. They can’t listen to me from, you know, for a long period of time. What are we doing in this half hour to change things up? What are we doing to change their brain? What’s going to ground the learning here? What can we bring them in? What will will they maybe be willing to contribute?

Shannon Mitchell
I loved it every training. I did Ages and Stages questionnaire training probably, let’s say, 30 times in six years. And it was different every time because of who was in the space. And that was a training that had a lot of content. So there wasn’t a lot of room for reflection, not a lot of room for… And still every single one of them was different.

Shannon Mitchell
And I learned something every time I did it. So that was really exciting to me. I really like that process of figuring out. I like talking to people, too. My favorite training was actually virtual online trainings.

Shannon Mitchell
So the in-person was good, but I really enjoyed people from all over the province together, sometimes all over the country, connecting differently and using some of the tools that I found. I got really excited about some of the tools that can engage interaction.

Shannon Mitchell
And so I really found it more enjoyable than I ever imagined, actually. But Sam, I want to go back to those burned out people you talked about. Can I? Please. I will tell you, I think I’ve heard you ask people, and I might be preempting a question, but I think I’ve heard you ask people, like, tell me about your favourite teacher, your favourite educator. I’ve had so many and know that there’s someone out there right

Shannon Mitchell
now who is feeling what you’re doing as a teacher and it is impacting their lives. I grew up in the 70s, 80s, 90s. I was born in the late 70s and I was a girl who was talkative and curious and that didn’t always go over well in public. People didn’t always love a little girl who had a lot to say. The world was changing, but my teachers, almost all of them, adored it and nurtured it. And I could tell you, you know, my kindergarten teacher, Mrs. Paddock, and I’m 47 years old, I can tell you about Mrs. Heffernan, who made room for me to learn in my own way. I can tell you about, you know, oh, I’ve lost her name. My grade four teacher, who’s

Shannon Mitchell
now an author, I even have her book and I’ve just completely lost her, Betty Dorian, who was like, oh, Shani, you’ve kind of missed some of this along the way. We had some split classes and stuff. Would you like some extra work to learn this grammar stuff? And I’m like, I’m here for it. And she’s like, I gotcha. Right. So people who really supported me my entire way, so if you’re kind of feeling burned out, look for that child because they’re there. Sometimes they’re the quiet one who’s like absorbed and sometimes they’re like

Shannon Mitchell
me and they got things to say and sometimes they challenge you and if I really like you, I will challenge you. So that’s something, you know, even in high school was a thing. And so just recognizing that there’s a child out there who needs what you’re doing right now and that doesn’t mean you can’t take a break, but it’s not what you’re doing now is not for naught.

Sam Demma
I appreciate you bringing that up, especially around this time of year. I think there’s a lot of people that have been really pushing hard and they’re reaching for the break and hoping that that break gives them what they need to show up again in the new year with full recharged batteries for others. How do you make sure you stay full so that when you do show up in spaces where you need to contribute to others, you have the capacity to do so.

Shannon Mitchell
I think it’s important to think about what parts of your job do feed you. Yeah. And what parts do take your energy. So I love the online virtual training, but actually days of an on-end were draining. I had to have a variety. So thinking about where in your work you can put those places in. And what about this thing do you really enjoy? If you’re teaching littles,

Shannon Mitchell
where can you put some breaks in that will support you and the children, right? So if you’re teaching older children, where can you let them explore themselves or express their opinions? You know, I had a teacher in high school who rearranged our desks. I used to sit in the back and our classroom ended up with the back seats weren’t there anymore. There was an extra row now. And I got there not in time to like pick the back desk. So I just sat down where my desk

Shannon Mitchell
used to be on the floor. And the teacher just taught the class as though nothing happened. And by about the fourth day, I’m sitting on the floor and I’m going, Oh, God, how am I going to get out of this? Like, how am I going to get out of this Sam? And he goes, Shannon, there’s a quiz today, get your desk. And I was so relieved to get my desk. Right? So recognizing what you need to take on and what you don’t. I mean, again, I still remember this. At the time, I can very distinctly remember thinking, now I’ve got myself into this and I don’t want to just go take a desk. But by the

Shannon Mitchell
time he kind of was like, it’s time, Shannon. I was like, yeah, yeah, it’s time. So recognizing what you need to take on and what you don’t, you know, having some faith in our young people and letting them control some of their learning. Oh, I have so much to say.

Shannon Mitchell
I absolutely love this story.

Sam Demma
I appreciate you sharing it. I think we choose our battles sometimes based on our own perceived needs or desires versus what might be best for us. And I’ve done it so many times in my own life. And yeah, I appreciate you.

Sam Demma
And what’s normal, right?

Shannon Mitchell
Like this perception of what we’re supposed to be doing and recognizing that, you know, you and I are half a country apart right now in two different cities, I think. I don’t know if you’re home, but I’m in Edmonton and to get down east, I mean, there are literally an infinite number of ways to get there. Even leaving my neighborhood, how many ways are there to leave? And is any way better than another, right?

Shannon Mitchell
And so recognizing that even if we’re going the same place, every path we take is valid and it might teach us something different. This time of year, I might see new Christmas lights even if I take the long way to my neighborhood. So is that the most effective way to get there?

Shannon Mitchell
No, but does it do something different for me than yesterday’s route did? Yes. And so really recognizing that it’s okay to let kids be on their own journey. I know you have like things you have to do. I’ve done training where I had

Shannon Mitchell
to, people have to be able to do this tool at the end. But really recognizing that, you know, if we get where we’re going, we get where we’re going.

Sam Demma
Yeah, I love it. Where do you want to go in the next few years? Do you have an idea of a, I know you’re in this phase of exploration, but maybe there’s someone listening to this who might be able to connect the dot for you.

Shannon Mitchell
Yeah, I am really become more and more passionate about the learning development area. And so I will be honest, there’s not a lot of jobs in my field as far as like, connecting early childhood and adult learning. If someone has one of those, I’d be happy to take it. I’m really looking at how to grow my skills and learning development and take a position in a job that will let me kind of use what I’m already good at. I’m an excellent facilitator. I’m excellent at developing programs. I need more practice on the self-directed learning side of development and those sorts of things.

Shannon Mitchell
And I need both of those things. I need to be able to use my skills and be learning to really thrive in a job. So if someone wants, you know, a trainer in a field I’m not familiar with, that gives me the opportunity to learn a whole bunch of new things too, which is fantastic. So I’m pretty open to a lot of different things right now. I’m really thinking about what my skills are, because I think I’m going to just get a little sociopolitical on you, Sam, but especially as women, we’re taught not to brag a lot and not to

Shannon Mitchell
own our strength and not to own our skills. And you’ll hear us say things like, oh, I just a lot more. Even when you read the research, women and actually people of colour and other people who experience marginalization are less likely to apply for jobs that they’re not like 95 percent

Shannon Mitchell
qualified for already. And so I’ve decided to be bold and apply for jobs that maybe I don’t think will call me back, but maybe they will. And so but it’s having to really be kind to myself too, because that means I’m putting out a lot of resumes

Shannon Mitchell
that aren’t getting callbacks. But I’m like, you know, 30% of these, I’m actually probably not expecting callback. And I need to teach myself to be okay with that. Yeah, so that’s where I’m at right now.

Sam Demma
And I’m so excited to hear about where it ends up. I’m sure whoever brings you onto their team is gonna absolutely love having you and be better off because of it. And if there is someone listening right now, I’ve had the opportunity to work with Shannon, and she was lovely to work with. And we enjoyed, I enjoyed all of our calls,

Sam Demma
and it was seamless. And I am not getting paid if she gets a job, just so anyone recognizes this is not a paid promotion, nor is it the reason that we set this up. We set it up well before she was in a new job search. She’s just a lovely human being that would add so much value to a team. And I hope that whoever’s listening recognizes that and opens some doors for you. In closing, Shannon, is there any last like big ideas or thoughts on your mind that you wanna share with the educators that are tuning in?

Shannon Mitchell
Yes, and I think this applies to your work too, Sam. And I did mention to this to you once in a call, but I think I can kind of tie together the educators we’ve been talking about, my experience, but also what you do. And I always think about when we talk about the little things that happen in life. Here you are, you do like three of these a week maybe. For me, it’s exciting, right? And so when you think about everything we do, if we think about it like pages in a book, you know, one page, rip, it’s gone.

Shannon Mitchell
It’s easy to rip that page. But there’s whole competitions about ripping a phonebook because it’s so hard to do. So when you think about everything that you’re doing in a positive way is really building. And honestly, we don’t need perfection in our caregivers. We don’t need perfection in our educators. Children are born to be resilient and they’re born to have people who are caring for them make mistakes and all those things. But every positive thing we do adds another page to that notebook. And as we’re going through life, we’ve got this big book of amazing things that are supporting us that can be really hard to break.

Shannon Mitchell
And so I think like you’re contributing right now another page to my book. You brought me in here and you’re like, I believe in you, Shannon, and I think that you have something to say. I think all of these educators who are watching are adding those pages to this children’s notebooks every day, and they’re not even realizing that they’re probably doing it. And so, and it doesn’t take much recognizing strengths, you know, looking for the positive

Shannon Mitchell
first, even we got to correct kids. But it doesn’t mean we can’t look for the positive first, right? All those kind of things that really build up children that will have these giant notebooks, which is the one thing they should keep in their backpack, Sam, for the whole life, right? I love it.

Sam Demma
So, so true. And within each notebook, there’s memories of people’s names on it, you know, attached to them. And so just to keep that in mind, like every action we take has an impact

Sam Demma
not only on the positive, but also it could be on the negative. And so let’s be cautious about the words we use and the actions we take. And yeah, I think about folks who have taught me what to do and taught me not what not to do.

Sam Demma
And both are equally as valuable, but some way heavier than others. If someone’s listening to this and they want to have a conversation with you, Shannon, or reach out, what would be the best way for them to get in touch with you?

Shannon Mitchell
I would say, I think you’re going to put things in the notes, right? So Linkedin, and there is my email that you’re perfectly welcome to engage with as well. Yeah, I’m learning to use LinkedIn and kind of enjoying the kind of more focused social media aspect of it, but certainly email is a good place to find me too.

Sam Demma
Well, thank you so much for taking the time to come on the show, keep exploring during this phase of your life. And I’m so grateful for your thoughts, your ideas and your presence. your ideas and your presence.

Shannon Mitchell
Thank you, Sam.

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February 20, 2025 by Sam Demma Social Worker Student Success 0

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